Rouelle Optimum G seminar at FS Germany

[PatClarke]

Hi to all interested,

We are trying to arrange an Optimum G seminar for Formula Students immediately following FSG at Hockenheim.
This would be Claude Rouelle's standard 3 day seminar at a very discounted price and I highly recommend anyone who can attend to do so.

It is not firm yet as we need numbers (50+) to make it feasable. I would like to hear expressions of interest either here or by email.

We have successfully organised these seminars at FS/FSAE competitions in the past and they have been hugely successful. We managed to attract 90+ to the seminar after FSAE-A last December and the reports were very positive.

Those who attend come away with a 50mm thick folder of notes, a sore head from the information and probably a CD with some very interesting equations and possibly a demo version of the Optimum K suspension kinematics program (I'll leave that up to Claude)

An added benefit will be we will have Claude as a Senior Design Judge and you get to hear the Claude and Pat double jokes act =]

Claude's commitment to FSG is just another indication of the growing importance of FSG. We should support him.

The seminar is notionally for FSG students, but if anyone else would like to attend, drop me an 'E' and we can talk about it.

Prices not fixed till we have an idea of numbers, but budget on less than half the price of the normal commercial seminar.

Cheers
Pat

[PatClarke]

Hi to all interested,

We are trying to arrange an Optimum G seminar for Formula Students immediately following FSG at Hockenheim.
This would be Claude Rouelle's standard 3 day seminar at a very discounted price and I highly recommend anyone who can attend to do so.

It is not firm yet as we need numbers (50+) to make it feasable. I would like to hear expressions of interest either here or by email.

We have successfully organised these seminars at FS/FSAE competitions in the past and they have been hugely successful. We managed to attract 90+ to the seminar after FSAE-A last December and the reports were very positive.

Those who attend come away with a 50mm thick folder of notes, a sore head from the information and probably a CD with some very interesting equations and possibly a demo version of the Optimum K suspension kinematics program (I'll leave that up to Claude)

An added benefit will be we will have Claude as a Senior Design Judge and you get to hear the Claude and Pat double jokes act =]

Claude's commitment to FSG is just another indication of the growing importance of FSG. We should support him.

The seminar is notionally for FSG students, but if anyone else would like to attend, drop me an 'E' and we can talk about it.

Prices not fixed till we have an idea of numbers, but budget on less than half the price of the normal commercial seminar.

Cheers
Pat

[Steve Fox]

I will throw in my .02¢ on Optimum G seminars right now. I will let everyone in on the secret right now that Formula Student Germany & Optimum G are, even at this late date, working out the final details to bring the price down even lower in order to be able to let as many students as possible attend this fantastic learning opportunity in Germany immediately following FSG! They are also working out the details to keep the camping area open for the three additional days of the seminar for those students that are camping at FSG. Details will be available soon. Within the next day or so.

I will mention that I have attended one of Claude's seminars. Yes a powertrain guy actually learning how the ˜other half' lives. Actually I am a closet chassis/suspension guy. Just don't tell anyone!

I knew from Claude's reputation, and stories that I had heard, that I was entering an almost magical learning experience. The class I went through had about 40 people in it. As I looked around the first few minutes, I wondered to myself: "How is Claude going to get all these different engineers to open up and actually admit that they either don't know something, or worse yet, that they do know a few ˜tricks', and then would not be willing to share with the class."�

Well I didn't have to wait long for the answer. The first thing Claude did when he started talking was to have us all introduce ourselves, explain what we did for a living, and what we expected to get out of this seminar. There was an amazingly diverse number of racing individuals in the room. They ranged from a kart racer all the way up to a few NASCAR team engineers, with lots of various different types of road racers in between. The next statement out of Claude's mouth was this: He said we are going to cover a lot of material in three days, and that if any one of us had a question, no matter how simple, or insignificant, we were to ask it. He then said that no matter what, everyone in the room had to ˜get it' when it came to any of the subjects that he would cover, and the entire class would stay on that subject until EVERYONE in class understood. It turned out to be a profound statement.

I was prepared for three eight hour days of learning. It turned out that everyone in the room, including Claude, was so enthusiastic about this subject that we actually spent ten to twelve hours a day in class. At lunch we would go and eat quickly (a half hour or so) and everyone would be right back in their seats eagerly wanting to learn more of what Claude was teaching. At the end of the day, no one wanted to leave. We all just kept asking questions, and were sitting on the edges of our seats listening to the answers, the stories, the jokes, and most importantly having a great time with other people that share the same passion for racing that you do.

There were two times that I recall in the three day seminar where one student did not get the concept that Claude was talking about at that moment. Within a few minutes, of further explanation, others in the class were speaking up and adding their own views, and experiences, coaching that one person along until he ˜got it'. It truly was not until everyone in class understood what Claude was explaining, that he then moved on to the next subject.

Pat mentioned a seminar folder. The one that I received in class is about 50mm thick. Everything in that book was covered up on the screen as part of Claude's PowerPoint presentation. The real bonus is that all the extra material Claude covers on the white board in class. I copied it all down into the margins of my book. I easily have twice as much material as what Claude originally printed in the book. He covers THAT much extra material in class.

If Claude ever took the time to figure out how much he makes per hour on these seminars, he would probably start charging double. A few years ago he kiddingly reminded me that his seminars are actually free. What you are paying for is the jokes. The opportunity for FSG competitors to attend Claude's seminar (at reduced student prices) is truly a once in a lifetime experience. Claude clearly enjoys what he does, and it shows. This is his way of giving back to the motorsport industry. Do yourself and your team a favor. Do not pass up the opportunity to attend one of Claude Rouelle's Optimum G seminars!

I know a lot of FSAE students have been through Claude's seminar here in the U.S. Let's hear about how the experience has positively affected your car, your team... or your career!

[ben]

Steve - you a closet marketing guy as well :-)

But seriously, I can't disagree with anything Steve or Pat have added (well maybe about Pat's jokes :-p )

Claude is actually coming to Dunlop next week to do a seminar with our technical guys plus race engineers from our LMS teams. I also attended the three day seminar (full price!) when I was still at Uni and it's the most valuable learning experience I've ever had other than building an FS car myself.

He will put your lecturers to shame - all of them...

Ben

[RiNaZ]

the seminar is grueling for sure. You spent 10-12 hours or more on his lecture. I remember coming in at 7am and finishing it at 9pm, but then by the time he finish giving out his last advice, it was close to 10 at night.

When i went for the seminar, you would see a couple of guys who fell asleep the first hour or so. The seminar is exciting, but it's grueling too with the hours. So get plenty of sleep and write down as much as you can, you will forget most of things in his lecture.

[Henrik Tallbacka]

I attended the seminar this winter in Tallinn and it was good.

Helsinki will be sending two of our junior team members to the FSG seminar. We were going to have them attend next year, but this was so convenient because we won't have to pay extra cost for traveling when it's just after the competition.

We've been sending people to Claude's seminars since 2003, and we've been very pleased.

[Gmuze]

My first post. Here goes.

After having a lot of doubts, I have signed up for the seminar. This is mainly thanks to all the great reviews Claude has received. On the other hand all the great reviews made me a little skeptic. Looking at the content of the seminar it is hard to believe that there are no reviews of people that don't feel satisfied. With the amount of subjects that will be discussed it is impossible to fully cover (read as: to everyone's satisfaction) them.

I'm not trying to bring Claude's seminar down. I'm just hoping someone can tell us, out of his/her own experience, what subjects he disagrees on with Claude and what topics missed depth.

Regards

[ben]

He presents roll centres in a kinematic sense rather than force based. But on the other hand OptimumK computes force based roll centres and kinematic roll centres are conceptually easier to explain so I don't have a big problem with it.

I seriously doubt you'll be disappointed.

Ben

[Steve Fox]

Hi Ben! See you in 35 days?

Gmuze, Do not have any reservations at all about Claude's seminar! I was speaking to Claude about this very subject at FSAE-MIS this year. He was very happily telling me that he has been doing these seminars for twelve years now, and in twelve years and thousands (tens of thousands?) of seminar attendees, he has had ZERO complaints. NONE! Not even one!

Not once has someone come up to him and said "I just wasted three days." or had someone say "Give me my money back, I did not learn anything." The customer satisfaction level that Claude is operating at is PHENOMINAL! Most companies strive for 90% or 95% customer satisfaction. Claude DELIVERS 100% customer satisfaction.

As far as the content of the seminar. Trust me, you will come away with more info than you can possibly retain. If you take notes as I did, you will have a very special and valuable piece of reference material that will last you well into your professional motorsports career (if that is where you are headed).

Didn't Claude come by and give your car a review at FSAE-MIS? If not, you missed out on a golden opportunity. Most students I talk to remember a critical review of their car, by Claude, as one of the highlights of their FSAE career!

I will see you in 35 days at Hockenheim. Good luck with your car. Remeber, in order to finish first, first you must finish!

[ben]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Steve Fox:
Hi Ben! See you in 35 days?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hi Steve! Sadly not - my GF is a high school teacher and the period where FSG is on is the beginning of the summer break. I have Nurburgring LMS race the week after so we have to take our vacation then.

I'm judging at FS at Silverstone though next week - as is Claude. following the seminar at Dunlop.

Ben

[Gmuze]

Hi Steve,

Unfortunatly I couldn't join the team on their trip to MIS. I was in Holland keeping my fingers crossed for a good result.

The reason I signed up for the seminar is because I do expect to learn a lot. I'm not worried about that. The reason FSAE delivers so many different cars is partly because of all the different opinions on how to tackle design problems. I was just wondering if there were any people that would handle design problems differently than Claude would. Their probably are, but that has little to do with how educational/satisfying the seminar is. Perhaps my choice of words has been confusing/misleading.

Eventhough I haven't worked on the design of this years car, I will be joining the team at Hockenheim. Perhaps we can have a little chat about the car outside the design event.

Regards,
Gabriel

[Steve Fox]

Gabriel,

Claude's seminars are full of different people with all different ideas & opinions. Claude does a wonderful job of explaining why idea X or idea Y works better than say idea A or idea B. He is NOT your ordinary lecturer http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif, that insists on skinning the cat the same way every time. He is very open minded, and will explore all different (right OR wrong) ideas with you in class. That is where a lot of the extra margin notes, for your book, really come from.

I would love to talk to you and your team outside the design tent. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I am really looking forward to seeing your new car. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif Oh by the way, you don't mind if I bring Claude along, when I visit, do you? He might even have a new joke or two! http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[Steve Fox]

At the risk of starting to sound like a one man cheering team for Optimum G (Claude doesn't even pay me to write this. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif Honestly! http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif ), I will share a letter that I received recently. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif This is from the Faculty Advisor of the Michigan State University Formula SAE team. He hosted the Optimum G seminar that immediately followed the FSAE-VIR event in June. I could not put it any better than Professor Cloud:


To: Steve Fox
RE: Optimum G Seminar by Claude Rouelle

Dear Steve:

I am excited to hear that you are encouraging Claude Rouelle of Optimum G to present his seminar on vehicle kinematics and dynamics in diverse venues so that more FSAE & FSG students can take advantage of this outstanding training opportunity.

As you know, Claude gave his seminar here at Michigan State University following the FSAE-East competition, at VIR, in June 2008. Below are my observations about the content and value of his program.

This seminar is actually a very intense short course. Monday and Tuesday went 12 hours with only short breaks. Wednesday lasted close to 14 hours. In other words nearly 37 hours of instruction, approximately a full college course equivalent, presented in 3 days. This is high-level material. If I had to classify it in a few words I would say it is multi-body kinematics and dynamics applied to very complex problems in systems where there are few clear-cut answers.

Claude is internationally famous for his experience, his intensive research, his racing success, his knowledge, his energy, his care for young people, and his ability to teach. He offers the training program about 25 times per year. When he gives the seminar to people from Toyota, Ferrari, and so on, the cost per seat is huge. He gives the same program to Formula SAE students after the major competitions at a greatly reduced rate because he is dedicated to teaching young people about engineering and life in general.

I sat in on a few hours of the sessions and can attest to Claude's success in this program. He is a master. Would that all our professors had his knowledge base and teaching skill.

Two of my own team members attended the full seminar. Their enhanced understanding was immediately apparent in that the team performed at a much higher level at the following FSAE-West design competition. These team members will return next year and I expect significant improvements in suspension design as a result of knowledge gained through the seminar.

Gary Cloud
Ph.D., P.E., FSEM, FInstP, CPhys., CSci.
University Distinguished Professor
Mechanical Engineering Department
Michigan State University
Faculty Advisor
MSU Formula SAE Racing Team


There you have it! "...nearly 37 hours of instruction, approximately a full college course equivalent, presented in 3 days." It doesn't get any better than that!

[RiNaZ]

and that is why i think anybody who's going to his seminar should brush up or learn as much as possible about vehicle dynamics.

There are more international teams participating in FSAE now, and if you're going to Claude's seminar, you should learn the terms as best as you could. Sometimes, there are terms that are commonly used like jounce or droop that are probably not familiar with the international people.

It is intense but fun for sure. I remember holding my pee until break time so i wont miss out on the important points.

I always felt that Claude's seminar solve 2 diseases that i had, insomnia and ADD (attention deficit disorder). I have always had trouble concentrating even for 10 mins, but at Claude's seminar, I was able to focus for 12 hours. And by the time i got back from the seminar, my mind was so tired, i went straight to bed when on a regular night, i can only sleep for 2 hours at the most before i wake up.

just thought i'd share that with you guys http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[ben]

He did force-based roll centres http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

And we definitely paid for the jokes http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Good luck to all at Silverstone at the weekend. I'll be around on Friday if anyone wants to talk tyres.

Ben

[J.R.]

I am new to the suspension game, and unfortunately I missed the seminar after MIS. I have been looking into getting grant money from my school to go to another seminar, but I can't seem to find any information about seminars other than the one at Hockenheim. Are there plans for any other seminars in the US during the academic year? Thanks!

[mangel83]

Does anyone knows if the camping site will be held open during the seminar days?

[screwdriver]

Are any more details available yet?