DRIFT!!!

[UQ Turbo]

G'day all,

I just fininshed watching Tokyo Drift (again) and thought I'd get an opinion on drift suspension setups.

Has anyone actually done any modelling for ideal drift setups or has it all been just trial and error? For example, if you are trying to encourage oversteer, why put massive rear wings on?

Also, for those that have seen the movie, do you think it's possible to have a deep and meaningful whilst drifting around jagged rocky mountain roads a couple of metres from the next car? http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

UQTurbo

[UQ Turbo]

G'day all,

I just fininshed watching Tokyo Drift (again) and thought I'd get an opinion on drift suspension setups.

Has anyone actually done any modelling for ideal drift setups or has it all been just trial and error? For example, if you are trying to encourage oversteer, why put massive rear wings on?

Also, for those that have seen the movie, do you think it's possible to have a deep and meaningful whilst drifting around jagged rocky mountain roads a couple of metres from the next car? http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

UQTurbo

[Ton]

drift is relatively low speed right?
so i dont think a wing would affect drifting ability by much

[SNasello]

the wings on the cars in tokyo drift do nothing except cause drag. they arent properly tuned for downforce (i doubt). Wings help the most if there is traction (not a factor in drifting) and are meant to increase traction, not help with oversteer.

[Scott Wordley]

Most "serious" drifters know that you set up a drift car wing upside down so it creates lift.

"Professional" drifters go one set further and turn the wing back to front to create thrust as well....

[Bryan Hagenauer]

http://www.speedtv.com/_assets/library/img/large/83119_dsc_0608.jpg

These are two of the dominating guys in the US pro drifting circuit. Both cars are obviously making some amount of downforce. It could be that they did it for looks, but the GTO seems to have more aggressive aero each year. Maybe he keeps asking for more?

I heard somewhere that they want the downforce because it increases the grip and allows higher speeds, even while sliding. I have no idea where I heard that, so take it with a grain of salt.

[TG]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bryan Hagenauer:
http://www.speedtv.com/_assets/library/img/large/83119_dsc_0608.jpg

These are two of the dominating guys in the US pro drifting circuit. Both cars are obviously making some amount of downforce. It could be that they did it for looks, but the GTO seems to have more aggressive aero each year. Maybe he keeps asking for more?

I heard somewhere that they want the downforce because it increases the grip and allows higher speeds, even while sliding. I have no idea where I heard that, so take it with a grain of salt. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What the hell is up with the wing on Rhys Millens car? That shit doesn't look real at all. Neither do the struts that hold the wing up. At least the wing on the viper "looks" real and even has a gurney flap on it.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Scott Wordley:
"Professional" drifters go one set further and turn the wing back to front to create thrust as well.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Haha, that's hilarious.

I haven't seen Tokyo Drift yet, and am not sure I ever will. If I do, it'll be because someone else wants to see it, not me.

[UQ Turbo]

Haha, thanks guys. TG, how dare you pay out Tokyo Drift! It's the biggest comedy of the year! My wings produce thrust too...

[SpeedAddictions]

While the plot of Tokyo Drift is laughable, the drifting scenes are top-notch. All the drifting was performed by Rhys Millen, Rod Millen, Sam Hubinette, and Tanner Foust. It might not mean much to the FSAE crowd, but they are all very accomplished drivers and drifters.
As far as set-ups go, it's all about steering angle, friend. Suspension set-up is critical. I am currently building a "drift truck" to compete with and also use as a tow vehicle for my shifter kart. We're currently designing a custom 4-link with panhard bar mated to a 8.8" rear-end and a custom coil-over setup, thus eliminating the stock leaf-springs. The front setup is going to be coil-overs with front bracing options currently being pondered over. The truck is a 97 Ford Ranger standard cab powered by a 2.3L Mustang SVO turbo 4-cyl. Of course, all the stock turbo bits have been removed and replaced with custom parts. Log-style exhaust manifold, TiAL 38mm external wastegate, Turbonetics Stage III T3/To4E hybrid turbo, Custom IC & piping, Greddy Type R BOV, Microtech LT8 EMS (just ordered, woot!!), Racer Walsh Road Race 4 in. crank pulley and adjustable cam gear, etc. A new steering rack is being designed to allow for better turning ratios. The truck was a beast to drive on stock computer with the kit and just a welded diff in the stock 7.5" rear end! I can't wait to get it back on the road with the EMS and suspension changes made!! Most set-ups are developed thru the tried & true way of track testing. Oh, and BTW, I'm about to transfer to University and get involved FSAE at whatever school I'm at. Currently work as a F-15 Crew Chief in the Florida Air National Guard. Moving to the Miami area in the coming month, then will be making the rounds to the schools in the area and checking out which ones have FSAE programs, etc. Thanks for taking the time to read this long post.

Regards,
Marcus

[Dan G]

Rhys appears (not driving) in the airplane scene, a couple rows infront of the hick.

Small world - I had beers with his younger brother Ryan the night after the movie came out.

[SpeedAddictions]

He appears in that scene, but also he's the one who drifted the 350z thru the corkscrew in the parking garage scene. At least that's what I read somewhere. You prolly had a lil bit better info though if you hung out with his bro.

[Dan G]

Oh yeah, I meant you can actually see his face. I think he was the one that did the majority of the Red Evo driving, probably some of the others. His shop was the one that put out that video of a RWD converted drift EVO a few years back, which was obviously not a coincidence with his involvement in the movie.

[SpeedAddictions]

Yea, I forgot he was the one who drove the EVO, for some reason thought that was Tanner Foust.
Neway, it doesn't matter really. I was just pleasantly surprised to see they didn't use a whole lot of cgi like 2F2F.

[Er Cuyaco]

A simple game like Need for Speed UnderGround 2 will help you visualize the settings for drifting.

I use low suspension on the back and high on the front, that gives a shift of the gravity center point and done, instant drifting

[kwancho]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SpeedAddictions:
He appears in that scene, but also he's the one who drifted the 350z thru the corkscrew in the parking garage scene. At least that's what I read somewhere. You prolly had a lil bit better info though if you hung out with his bro. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That was sweet. I thought that maybe the car was on rollers or something, but it looks pretty real.

[Steve Yao]

Drifting does not necessarily mean low grip or low speed. Its definately lower grip than pure grip driving, but all drifting means to the tire is a super high slip-angle for the rear; both lateral(the drift) and longitudinal (wheel spin). At the first GT Live event at Fontana, entry speeds into the competition area were being announced as 90-100mph. Not F1 or NASCAR speeds, but not exactly slow either.

To carry the drift through a turn at as high a speed as possible you still want grip. A race tire at high slip still produces heaps more grip than an all-weather street tire at high slip...not to mention durability.

So drifting versus grip'ing you would want larger yaw moments on entry and exit to over rotate the car. You are counter-steering at steady state so you may even want your castor reversed for best mid-corner grip, but that will probably depend on what you value in your drift performance. i.e. Lots of wheel spin for showmanship or minimal wheel spin to maintain more grip and pass/keep up with your competitor. Each scenario would require different levels of front end grip to maintain balance at a given drift angle.

And of course to achieve super angles and recover, you need as much steer angle as you can get, probably quicken your wheel rate as well.

So anyway, I agree with the 'hearsay' that Bryan mentioned as far as wings. More grip allows higher speed drifts. Of course those wings are not really optimized for diagonal airflow. it would interesting to start seeing drifters use swept/vee/chevron shaped wings to make better use of the airflow's direction when drifting. Hell, if the course has a mostly low speed sections and one long highspeed section, you could bias the angle of the wing to one side just for it.

[absolutepressure]

I am the drift MASTER!!!!...on snow.

[darienphoenix]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by absolutepressure:
I am the drift MASTER!!!!...on snow. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I can do awesome drifts in my hovercraft. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif