Registration for SAE-A 2008

[ShaunM]

Hi there !
My name is Shaun and I'm from Malaysia. My friends and I are interested in joining the formula SAE-A 2008. We were wondering if anyone could help give us information pertaining to Formula SAE-A 2008 ? We would be most grateful.

[PatClarke]

Hi Shaun,
The FSAE-A event at Werribee near Melbourne will be held on the last weekend in November or the first weekend in December 2008. Date not finalised yet. Entries have not opened yet.
The website for the competition is http://www.sae-a.com.au/fsae/index.htm
Please bookmark this site and check it regularly.
The event will be run to the standard FSAE rules, but there will be some supplementary regulations relating only to the Australian event. You should be familiar with these. To get an idea, look at the Supp. Regs. for the 2007 event, these will be very similar for 2008.
You should email the organisers and express an interest in the event. This will get you on the email mailing list.
Hopefully, we will see you in December
Cheers
Pat

[MalcolmG]

Pat, are you sure about those dates? The last couple of years it's been closer to the middle of December, and I had the impression that this was better for most teams (although I do recall some complaints in 2006 about the timing coinciding with some University's final exams).

Earlier will certainly make our flights cheaper, but late November means the car will need to be on its way over while we're still in exams

[PatClarke]

Hi Malcolm,
The date isn't set yet, but those are the dates currently being suggested. There have been requests to run the event a little earlier, flight costs being one of the issues.

However, I have no say in this, the FSAE-A consortium will soon establish the actual date and it will be posted on the FSAE-A website.
See you there
Pat

[ShaunM]

Thank you very much !

[ShaunM]

Dear Mr. Clarke,

This is the first time that we would be joining this competition. Having said so, we were wondering whether there is sufficient time for us to complete the car as we are still in the design stages ? I'd like your honest opinion about this please. Thank you !

Best regards,

Shaun M

[Chris Lane]

I guess that is dependent on the experience your team has in FSAE.

One of my lecturers Kevin Hayward once said he could get a FSAE car out in under a month if he really wanted to. Then again, he is practically a walking encyclopaedia on race car theory.

It can be done for sure, but you need a tight schedule and a very dedicated team.

[Pete M]

I think it depends on what you mean by "still in the design stages". Do you mean you are finishing off a few little details prior to manufacture or is the car still very much just a concept on paper?

Since its your first year, i'll just give the standard warning that manufacture takes a lot more time than you expect it to, and you can never seem to get enough testing time after the car is built.

[PatClarke]

Shaun,
Sure you can finish a car in time for the Australian competition, however, it will require some discipline!

Firstly, finalise a simple design very quickly. No clever stuff, just a simple car that complies with the rules.

Secondly, I said 'Finalise' !! Freeze your design and build the car. You can do all the clever stuff next year. Have a look at the FSAEA or FSG sites and find the paper I wrote for new teams. Read it and heed it.

Thirdly, and please do not be offended by what I am going to say. Many teams from East and South East Asia have cultural mores that get in the way of good project management. EVERYone has to get their hands dirty.

Malaysia has a viable automotive industry. The small Proton (Savvy?) is probably a good source of brakes, wheels, axles etc. Ask Proton for help. Explain to them what you are doing and why. Proton have to source their engineers from somewhere.

The challenge you are facing is one that thousands of students face every year, some more successfully than others.

Whatever you do, make sure you keep records and notes to pass on to the next team, so they wont have to start from the same place as you. As Chris pointed out, a car can be built in a month (BTW Chris, give my regards to Kevin) but to do that you really have to understand what you are doing. As you will be learning, then 6 months should be plenty =] so you should be finished and testing by September, plenty of time to ship to Australia for November or December.

Finally, don't be afraid to ask for help. The people here are great, but a word of warning....Use the search function first! Most newbie questions have already been asked and answered several times.

I am no longer the Tech Advisor for FSAEA (That may change again!) but I will help if you really need it.

Regards
Pat Clarke

[Chris Lane]

No worries Pat, I'll pass that on! http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[RiNaZ]

Shaun, like Pat, i too would like to extend a helping hand in any way i can. Im not in malaysia, but you can email me any questions you have about the car. And i also know your team advisor personally.

just like pat suggest, look into local car manufacturer for help and ideas. I know there are several ex-FSAE from UK universities in the local car industry that could probably help out. You just have to find them. Also, Perodua is also another good car company for parts, and they have even smaller car than Proton SAVVY.

Whatever questions you have, feel free to ask me thru email/IM/phone. Im trying my best to avoid what had happened to the last malaysian team at the OZ competition (long story).

I wish you all the best.

[drywater]

hey shaun this is ankit from dce delhi india
we have faced these problems earlier.
i completely agree with pat
I do not want to discourage your team but i want to tell you that it is very difficult to get resources in south east asia and within our low budgets it is very difficult to even build the car and make it running forget about testing
as far as time is concerned due to exams and intervention of our university it takes way too much time than you think.
what i recommend is build a solid(maybe overdesigned) car take a year to build it and then go to the class 1200 competition next year.that is the best way to approach these competitons.
www.defianzracing.in (http://www.defianzracing.in)

[RiNaZ]

I think it's difficult to get the car done when southeast asia teams try to get parts and resources from other parts of the world, mainly, US and UK. But i think you should use this as an opportunity to be innovative in your car design. Every year, you would see somewhat similar cars being produce by most of the teams. So if you can bring in something new and well within your budget, it will surely catches the judges attention and your car would definitely stand out among other competitors.

One part that comes to mind is the engine. If you could somehow incorporate those small K-car engine into your car design,it would definitely save you some time and money i think. It's heavier but it's 3-4 times cheaper than an F4i that you have to get from US/UK/Japan, and it's readily available. The biggest drawback is finding a small gearbox to go with it or you might even have to design a new gearbox for it.

Main thing is, be creative. Something that would work overseas might not work for a team in southeast asia.

[PatClarke]

Drywater and Shaun,

Be aware that there is only a 'Class 200' at Formula Student in the UK. All other competitions have only one class, and you must bring a new design each year. Shaun is looking at FSAE Australasia, so he doesn't have the Class 200 option

Pat

[ShaunM]

Dear all,
I truly am grateful for the overwhelming responses that I have received in the form of advice, suggestions and warnings.
I am very sure that we can finish the car in time for the Australian competition. This is because our members are all from the aviation faculty. Thus, enabling us to have a lot of experience as well as equipment at our disposal. However, I remain vigilant over possible problems that we might face during the manufacturing of the prototype. Our main concern right now is whether we can get enough funding to manufacture the car as well as to travel and compete in Australia.

Warm regards,

Shaun M

[ShaunM]

Dear Mr.Lane,

Thank you very much for your positive response. I believe that my team can make it.

Warm regards,

Shaun M

[ShaunM]

Dear Mr.Pete M,

What I meant by "still in the design stages" is that it is still a concept on paper as you put it. Still, I think that the car can be ready for manufacture within the next few weeks. This is because the design team is working hard to complete it by the first week of April.

Best regards,

Shaun M

[ShaunM]

Dear Mr.Clarke,

First of all, I would like to thank you for the enormous amount of encouragement that you have shown for our team.

What you said about finalizing our design is exactly in line with what our team advisor has been telling us to do. He tells us to keep it simple as this is our first time competing. Rest assure, that I will read the newsletter you wrote for new teams. As I have mentioned in a previous post, our main concern right now is in obtaining funding. Thank you for your gesture of kind help, it is most appreciated.

Hoping you are well,

Shaun M

[ShaunM]

Dear Mr.Rinaz,

Your help is most welcomed and appreciated. Mr.Hendra sends his regards.

Hoping that you are well,

Shaun M

[ShaunM]

Dear drywater,

What Mr.Clarke said is true. We are aiming for FSAE-A. We believe that we can complete the car in time. Your gesture of concern is appreciated.

Warm regards,

Shaun M

[PatClarke]

Hi all,
I just had confirmation from the SAE-A office.
The dates for FSAE-A 2008 are..

Thursday 27th November through to Sunday 30th November.
Details should be on the website soon.

Cheers
Pat

[brettd]

Hey Pat,

This doesn't happen to be an April fools joke does it?

Brett

[Chris Lane]

Wicked! The week after exams for us here...

Thanks for that Pat!

[Moke]

We thought it might be one week earlier than last year but 3 is extreme. Means we have to ship during our exams.

[drywater]

same problem is with us here in india,
but it is worse as we are having our exams during the competition so it would be impossible for us to participate if it is from 27 november

ankit

www.defianzracing.in (http://www.defianzracing.in)

[Chris Lane]

Originally posted by drywater:
same problem is with us here in india,
but it is worse as we are having our exams during the competition so it would be impossible for us to participate if it is from 27 november

ankit


Now THAT sucks.

Talk to your Dean or Head of School and see what the possiblities are for deferring your exams until after the comp....

[Studdert]

Hi,

I'm from Newcastle University and am finding myself very concerned with the dates that FSAEA 2008 has decided upon. Our exam period does not finish untill the 28th November. Typically we would leave Newcastle for Melbourne on the tuesday before the competition weekend, which happens to be the 25th November.
I believe that this issue needs to be addresed as it would seem that our university is not the only team that would be disadvantaged in terms of car preparation as well as exam revision.

Can these dates please be confirmed and a contact for the SAE-A office be posted to refer our concerns onto.

Many thanks.

[Brett Neale]

It's something you'll have to live with. Like Chris suggested, talk with your Dean of school to have your exams rescheduled.

AFAIK this is around the same time as previous competitions before 2007?

[PatClarke]

Hi all,

The November 27 date has been set. Last year the event was delayed almost til Christmas for various reasons. There were complaints and problems.
This year it was intended to bring the event back to it's early December date. The V8 supercars are racing on the first weekend of December, and that will pull away many judges. Rather than run the event later like last year, it was decided that the last weekend in November was appropriate and so the date was locked up.
Helen, the lady at FSAEA who looks after the website has been ill, so the website has not been updated with the event date.

If teams can put up cogent arguments why the event should be moved to the 11th to 14th of December, then I suggest you contact the SAE-A office and make your case....PRONTO!!!
As far as I can recall, the FSAE-A event has always conflicted with someones schedule but we have always been able to get around it.

Cheers
Pat

[Davo]

I agree with Chris and Brett. Talk to the lecturer about getting it moved. The 05 event was from the 1st to the 4th of December. We had an exam on the 30th of November which kinda clashed with our 12hr drive to the event so we asked the lecturer. He was happy to move it once we explained that it was because of a conflict with a uni project. Also if they won't budge on moving it back, consider having the exam moved forward to before the event. It's not ideal but if it means you can compete then it'd be worth it.

[drywater]

in india the situation is different ,our universities have a quite strict schedule which does not change with student requirments.
thanks

ankit

www.defianzracing.in (http://www.defianzracing.in)

[Chris Lane]

Well, call a meeting with your Dean and the Chancellor of the university and explain your situation. After all, you ARE representing THEM and it is in their best interests to accommodate you.

All you can do is ask, and push for the resolution you need.

[brettd]

Looks like it'll be an interesting comp.

I take it that the FISITA World Championship bit is meant to apply for the 2009 Australian competition as the 08 one is in Detroit?

[TMichaels]

Does anybody know what happened to the FSAE-A website? It is down and I wanted to know, when the registration will start...can somebody help me out?

Regards,

Tobi

[PatClarke]

Tobi,
The SAE-A recently moved office and have had some staff changes.
We noted the site was down a couple of days ago and brought it to the SAE-A attention.
I haven-t had any chance to talk to them again this week, but I will do on Monday. Hopefully the website will be up again shortly.
Meanwhile, I know you are coming ;-)
If the worst comes to the worst, I will be in Melbourne week after next.

But don't be concerned, all is well under way. The new Co-ordinator Marissa is working hard on stuff.
Cheers
Pat

[Chris Lane]

Originally posted by TMichaels:
Does anybody know what happened to the FSAE-A website? It is down and I wanted to know, when the registration will start...can somebody help me out?

Regards,

Tobi

Registration is already open, and is due to close next month (off the top my head).

If you need a registration package, I can pm you one while the SAE-A website is down. All you need to do then is post it to Melbourne and you're set!

Let me know so I can pm you this pdf.

[Fil]

If there are any international teams racing at FSAE-A 2008 that need somewhere to work on their car and test please feel free to contact me. We have lots of space around our workshop and we also have a really awesome test facility close to uni.

We are more than happy to take some teams in. We know how important it is to have a good base while overseas. Please organise it with us now so we can make arrangements early especially for accommodation and the like.

Last year the uni sort of cracked the sads when we didn't tell them UNSW was going to be working in our hallway. So the earlier you organise it the better.

[tool]

Hi,
We are a first year team, looking to participate in the Australia event. We have sent the registration form already. Unfortunately, due to some administrative hassles it will take us around 3-4 days more to route the money for registration fees. I wanted to know how soon the registration spots get filled up.

Also, how many teams participate in the Australia event?

Team Raftar,
IIT Madras, India

[Brett Neale]

I can't answer your first question, but last year there was about 22 or so teams competing at FSAE-A, and about 30 the year before.

[PatClarke]

Tool, Contact the FSAE-A office (The website is up again) telling them of your intent to order. They will understand that money transfers sometimes take time.
It is unlikely that FSAEA will be oversubscribed. Normally there are between 20 and 25 entrants.
Cheers
Pat

[Jon Oneill]

Our uni's exam timetable ends much the same time as people have mentioned before but i'm sure we can work around it with the faculty.
I hope everyone can still make it there.
I know were going to struggle enough without the added challenge of exams while the comp is on.
Talk to your deans people.

[Nitesh]

Originally posted by Chris Lane:
Well, call a meeting with your Dean and the Chancellor of the university and explain your situation. After all, you ARE representing THEM and it is in their best interests to accommodate you.

All you can do is ask, and push for the resolution you need.

Hi Chris, Appreciate your concern about our participation in the FSAE-A event but the biggest problem we face (leaving aside the exam thing) is getting the college/university management to understand exactly what you said in the abovementioned post. These guys at our college are a bunch of bureaucratic idiots who fail to understand the importance of such competitions. The situation is sad to the extent that a majority of the management believes that it is for a "trip across the seas" rather than the design competition.
That said, the exams can't be shifted as the participation is only from one of the two colleges in the university and the complete university exams of all the semesters and departments have to be conducted on a common schedule. Adjusting the practical exams though are feasible but not the theory papers. Anyways, the team has already landed at silverstone for the FS-UK. Hope to have a nice competition for the team during the enxt four days(i won't be there as i have now graduated from the college).

Cheers

[TMichaels]

Do you think there will be any chance to register a bit later than the deadline says? We want to participate, but because of the crash we are actually in trouble getting the funds.

Regards,

Tobi

[Chris Lane]

Originally posted by TMichaels:
Do you think there will be any chance to register a bit later than the deadline says? We want to participate, but because of the crash we are actually in trouble getting the funds.


Shoot an email to the SAE-A office. They'll get onto it real quick.

formulasae@sae-a.com.au

Hope to see you guys there

[mok]

Does anybody know anything abou who is going to come to australia this year? I expect some more overseas teams to be there, as it is a FISITA World Cup.

By the way, Stuttgart is thinking about coming to AUS as well. But just like Braunschweig, we have to check our funds first...

[TMichaels]

Hey Michael,
maybe we can save some money by going together.

Regards,

Tobi

[MalcolmG]

Isn't the 2009 Aus comp the FISITA world cup?

[MalcolmG]

ok I just checked the FISITA website, is that a typo or are there really 2 "world cups" this year?

[Chris Lane]

Quote from the FISITA website;


The next FISITA Formula SAE World Cup competition will be held as part of Formula SAE Australasia, organised by SAE A, at the Victoria University, Werribee in the last week of November 2008.

The current holders of the FISITA Formula SAE World Cup are UWA Motorsport, Australia.

Since the dates for next years' SAE-A have not been set, I'd say this is accurate and there are two World Cups this year.

[Chris Lane]

Quick question about the Australian Addendum for section 4.3.11 of the rulebook...

The ruling reads:
"Costs may be submitted in $US or $Australian but all conversions will be made using the Reserve Bank of Australia official exchange rates for all currencies applicable on 29 June 2008 refer to www.rba.gov.au (http://www.rba.gov.au)"

Since the 29th of June was on a weekend, do we use the rates on the 27th or the 30th? http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

[PatClarke]

Chris,
Why would you pose a question like that on here? This forum is totally unofficial. Nothing you read here can be accepted as fact when asking about the rules or requirements about any official competition.

At FSAE-A we are aware of the amomaly in the date. It was caused by an error in rewriting the 2007 Supplementary regulations to 2008.

A quick email to the FSAE-A office would give you the answer.
I could too, of course, but because it is on here, it wouldn't be official ;-)

Regards
Pat

[Chris Lane]

Hey Pat!

I asked on here to see if I could get a quick answer on a weekend. However, it seems everyone is studying and/or manufacturing their cars!

I'll shoot an email through to the office now and see what's what.

Cheers!

[TMichaels]

I read about the Appendix A1, that should be used for the SSEF in the FSAE-A Rules Addendum. But it is not attached to the Rules Addendum. Does anyone know, where to get it?

Regards,

Tobi

[Chris Lane]

I can only find the offical SAE one @ http://www.sae.org/students/fsaesef.pdf

You should email formulasae@sae-a.com.au for instructions

[Tom W]

Originally posted by TMichaels:
I read about the Appendix A1, thaht should be used for the SSEF in the FSAE-A Rules Addendum. But it is not attached to the Rules Addendum. Does anyone know, where to get it?

Regards,

Tobi

I think you are referring to appendix A1 of the complete (US) rules, page 109, or the link that Chris posted.

[TMichaels]

That was my fault. Thanks for the hints guys!

Regards,

Tobi

[tool]

Hi,
Section 1B of CAMS License application form asks for the name of CAMS affiliated club to which the applicant belongs. All these clubs are Australian. What are overseas teams supposed to fill up? I have sent a mail to the organizers. Looking for some urgent replies, hence posted here.
Thanks
Abhishek, IIT Madras

[Chris Lane]

There is a 'Formula SAE Australasia Inc' club listed on CAMS.

We didn't use it as we're all members of a local car club, but if you're from overseas then I would be thinking you use the SAE-A one.

Make sure you get a level '2S' licence, not the '2NS' one.

[woodsy96]

I got in contact with CAMS last week, and they said that the car club for international teams is "Formula SAE Victoria".

The person I got in touch with at CAMS was Sheryl-Lee Raggatt, (03) 9593 7725 (Direct).

It is worth noting that international teams do not get a "CAMS license", but an "Authority to Compete". The form to apply is the same, however it does not entitle you to a 12 month CAMS license (We thought that our drivers last year might not have to reapply as their CAMS licenses would last 12 months. This was not the case).

[theloyal]

Hi, we are first year team and have a plan to participate in FSAE Australia this year.
i want to ask that cost table for materials, tollings and fasteners that are posted in the website were originally posted at 28 November 2010 and now prices of some parts have increased. like we want to purchase Damper that are given in table have 125$ unit price whereas we found that damper of 175$. Then we are surely going to loose marks in cost, so what should i do now in this scenario..??
Regards

[Bemo]

The prices in the cost tables are based on the assumption that you are building 1000 cars per year and therefor get a better price.
It doesn't matter what you really paid for parts. If you have the latest materials table, just use the prices you find in there that's all that counts.