Engine help

[UCSB Turbo]

I'm stumped. We finally got the new ECU wired, fuel and coolant lines plumbed and are ready to start our engine for the first time with the new ECU.

However, it just doesn't want to start. There were a few problems with the wiring that were sorted out so now at least the right coil should be firing with the right injector at the right time. Yet, the car still doesn't want to start. The best we have gotten so far is to hold the throttle 3/4 open, crank the engine, and we get a couple intermittent pops out the exhaust and out the intake. One backfire blew a hole in the foam air filter we had on there. LOL.

The really bizarre thing is that there is hardly any vacuum or exhaust pressure when cranking. The MAP sensor detects like a 0.1psi change in pressure when cranking. Additionally, there is a good amount of air coming out the crankcase vent. Enough so that I'd say more air is coming out the vent versus the exhaust. Kinda strange.

The engine is a 2001 Suzuki GSXR600 with a firing order 1243. The ECU is a Performance Electronics model. We wired coil driver wire 1 to cylinders 1 and 4, and coil driver wire 2 to 2 and 3. The injectors are wired the same way.

We have tried adjusting the duty cycle of the injectors from like 0.8ms to 2.5ms with no improvement. I think we are running some 87 octane just to get it running and have the base timing set at 5 BTDC.

The ECU picks up all the signals. It reads the crank sensor, IAT, MAP, and TPS just fine. The fuel pump primes for about 5 seconds when you first turn the system on, just as it should.

I am completely out of ideas at this point.

The only theory I have left is the possibility that the head was rebuilt wrong. We had to remove the head to swap out the crank angle sensor. In doing so, I am wondering if the cams are off enough teeth to cause problems like this. As I stated, theres just about no vacuum when cranking which makes it sound like there is no compression but the bottom end hasn't been touched and the engine ran fine prior to all this work.

Any ideas?

Adrian Avgerinos
UC Santa Barbara

[Jeff Stroh]

is this a custom ECU or an off the shelf?

if it's MoTeC i can probably give you some pointers. otherwise...

if it is "firing" but not running my guess is that somehow the crank index position is off (assuming your ECU uses this). on our engine we generally had to fiddle with this number until we got the engine to start, and then adjusted to the correct position with a timing light and fixed timing on the engine. starts like a champ!

i doubt you're having a fuel issue, my guess is it is a spark timing issue.

[UCSB Turbo]

The ECU is from Performance Electronics. As custom as they come.

I'm not sure we can adjust how the ECU reads the crank position sensor. Its just a hall effect sensor so if its not lined up right I think we would need to take the engine apart again and realign the sprocket to get it to read differently.

[BStoney]

Contact Brian Lewis at Performance Electronics brian@pe-ltd.com or check the website for phone number. He is always more than willing to help.

www.pe-ltd.com (http://www.pe-ltd.com)

[Marc Jaxa-Rozen]

Have you checked for intake or exhaust leaks? Are you getting good fuel pressure readings? Can you fire both coils and injector banks from the Diagnostics menu?

Just a few ideas...we had the same problems on our CBR until we resealed the intake and changed the exhaust flange gaskets, it really makes a big difference.

Good luck-

Marc Jaxa-Rozen
École Nationale d'Aérotechnique

[UCSB Turbo]

Ran diags and the fuel and ignition channels fire as they should.

We will check the intake and exhaust for leaks.

We just got our fuel pressure gauge in the mail today so we will try to hook it up to get readings though the injectors do seem to have atleast enough pressure to mist as evident by firing them through the diag program.

Supposedly TWM set the FPR to 50psi.

I think Brian is getting to know us pretty well based on our lack of experience with aftermarket ECUs. I think I have PE's number on speed dial in fact. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[B Lewis @ PE Engine Management]

Hey Adrian,

Let's set up a time when you are in front of the engine and I can walk you through getting it started. When is good for you? Otherwise, give me a call at the office this weekend. You may catch me there. Otherwise leave me a message and I will get back to you.

[UCSB Turbo]

Well good news. I get a text message at 1am last night on my phone saying that its alive! Sweet! I spoke with one of my team mates but he didnt seem to know exactly what they did to fix the problem. He did mention that I had wired the coils incorrectly. I looked at the manual again today and apparently I had wired the coils in parallel rather than series. Doh!

Once I find out what else was done to get it running, I'll let you guys know. At the very least, for your amusement. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[ethanL007]

The whole parallel/series thing is a mistake I have seen (us), and heard about (many other teams) with the PE-Ltd ECU. I think the problem stems from engineers not wanting to read manuals. You are lucky you didn't cook the coil drivers like we did. Ask Brian, it is an all to common mistake.

[UCSB Turbo]

Nah, I read the manual. I just read it wrong. LOL. Though, I don't know whats worse: Reading the manual wrong, or not reading it at all.

[alfordda]

It will run with the coils wired backwards. Just not for very long. We had ours running for about 15-20 minutes before the coils and coil drivers went up in smoke. The guys at PE are pretty understanding.

dan

[osubeaver]

UCSB Turbo,
If you are having pops through the intake it sounds as if you may somehow have a gross timing error (ie crank position sensor is set up wrong or something in software).