Aprilia sxv 550

[beckspp]

Hello Guys,
I am doing a project for my masters.oil tank design for the Formula Student Car 2011.The car has a Aprilia sxv 550 engine and the car is currently using the stock oil tank.I need to design a oil tank with some sort of cooling mechanism (like fins or heat pipes). The oil has to be maintained at a temperature of 30 degree Celsius Please help with me any solutions guys.

[povelocj]

Keeping the oil at 30 degree Celsius? That might be a bit difficult... What are your intentions with doing that? Do you know what temperature engine oil usually gets up to? I'm a bit curious at to why you chose this for your masters project.

[Dash]

Originally posted by beckspp:
I am doing a project for my masters

I think you got this. Just make the radiator like 100" by 100" and you might get there. Will be a little hard if its above 30C outside though!

[Matt Clark]

Hi beckspp

Good to hear your getting involved with the design,

The two things you need to think of first are,

1.Oil volume you will need to supply to the engine (1.3 L stock for the 550)

2. operating temperature of the oil,

the first will depend on a number of factors, and is obviously a compromise, weight, packaging etc,

the second is very important, and I would suggest a great deal of reaserch into this, you have quoted "30 degree celcius" but this is very wrong and I think you should find out for yourself why this is the case.

however a constant oil temperature is desireable, the value of that is what is important to you... this along with your oil volume will point you onto a pretty good path for deciding on the heat rejection you will need in your oil system,

Google is your friend... use it as there are many good articled on how to design a good oil tank, swirl pots, baffles, pickups etc,

cheers,

[penna]

hmm, you might want to get a clarification on this one. Typical oil temps, in our car at least, are around 100 deg under normal operating conditions. Apart from this running the oil constantly at 30 is not a good idea as you get lots of viscous losses and lots of other bad things happening to your engine (I'm sure you will find out). Engines generally have a "happy" temp they like to sit at to run best for performance and efficiency, so you might want to find out what this is rather than aiming for your 30 deg.

[Warpspeed]

Normal running oil temperature should ALWAYS be above 100C.

If it is not, fuel and water will very quickly build up and dilute the oil and kill your engine bearings.
Keeping the oil hot boils off any moisture condensation or fuel in the sump.

Just remember, the hydrogen in the fuel combines with oxygen in the air to create water vapor in the exhaust. Even an air cooled engine sees a lot of water get into the sump.

On a crispy cold morning, you can see steam coming from the exhaust pipe of a freshly started engine.

[penna]

Thanks for your reply...
got any ideas for the tank design with fins or heat pipes...?
I would probably check out traditional oil coolers first i.e water to oil and air to oil to find some inspiration and go from there. Oil cooling is not a new thing so familiarize yourself with what is out there first

[Michael Royce]

beckspp,
Like a couple of the others, I would seriously challenge the remit that you were given. The optimum water temperature, all things being considered for the cooling system on a water-cooled engine is around 100 deg C, give or take a few degrees. This takes into account ambient air temperatures, heat transfer, etc., etc. The oil temperature on an engine tends to run at least 5-10 degrees C hotter.

As Warpspeed says, you need an elevated temperature to boil off some of the unwanted stuff that gets into the oil. Also, what ambient temperature is this system supposed to be working under. This is a vital condition! There is no way you are going to get oil down to 30 degrees is the ambient is 35 degrees, at least with an system that is maintainable without some sort of phase change material. I would also say that who ever set you tis task has no idea what is need for an IC engine to work properly. Maybe it is just a theoretical exercise no no practical application.

Go back and get the full remit and let us know!

[Warpspeed]

If you are dealing with really extreme ambient temperatures in either direction, an oil/water heat exchanger can be an excellent way to control oil temperature.
Obviously assuming the engine is water cooled <grin>.
These usually consist of a plate type heat exchanger that fits between the screw in oil filter and the engine block. Usually quite easy to adapt to an existing engine if the need arises.

[beckspp]

Originally posted by Warpspeed:
If you are dealing with really extreme ambient temperatures in either direction, an oil/water heat exchanger can be an excellent way to control oil temperature.
Obviously assuming the engine is water cooled <grin>.
These usually consist of a plate type heat exchanger that fits between the screw in oil filter and the engine block. Usually quite easy to adapt to an existing engine if the need arises.
Dear Tony,
What would be the maximum temperature the oil when it gets into the oil tank from the scavenge pump? any idea?

[Warpspeed]

Why guess when you can measure the temperature easily enough.

[KustomizingKid]

But taking actually measurements requires actual work... why can't Google just tell you everything all the time.

[Matty C]

beckspp,

im not sure how much literature review, if any uni of syd requires you to do, but may i suggest two things.

1. SAE papers and/ or some use of google

2. talking to your team members, last i heard usyd is planning to get more hands on with engine maintenance, so there should be at least one person in your team with the answers to your questions, just may need a beer or two to co-operate.

im not going to tell you the answers you seek, as a number is pointless if you don't understand how you got to that number and what it implies...

[Fantomas]

Not to mention that it is quite hard to cite in your master thesis that your target oil temperature was set by "a guy in the FSAE forum".

This is your master thesis, show that you deserve the engineering degree that you will get after completing it.

Fantomas