First Time Team..

[Blake_DFSAE]

Hi, my name is Blake and I'm on a startup team from Dalhousie University from Halifax, NS.

I was just wondering if anyone had any tips for a new team, it'd be real nice to not make stupid mistakes when we'd like to compete in 07.

Also, on a side note, does anybody have a drawing of a 96-99 GSX-R600 motor? All we're really looking for at the moment is accurate measurements of the mounting points but i'm sure it'd be damn useful anyways.

Thanks for the advice

Blake

[Blake_DFSAE]

Hi, my name is Blake and I'm on a startup team from Dalhousie University from Halifax, NS.

I was just wondering if anyone had any tips for a new team, it'd be real nice to not make stupid mistakes when we'd like to compete in 07.

Also, on a side note, does anybody have a drawing of a 96-99 GSX-R600 motor? All we're really looking for at the moment is accurate measurements of the mounting points but i'm sure it'd be damn useful anyways.

Thanks for the advice

Blake

[LSU Dave]

Make a solid model of almost everything to make sure it fits.

Most suspension books are designing suspensions for indy.

Get the suspension geometry done early.

Read these forums and find all of the links and info you can.

Go to this year's comp.

Make friends with UTA and A&M http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[terra_dactile]

hi blake,
check out the following sites,

http://www.formulastudent.com
and
Formula Germany

both sites have PDF documents directed at new teams that are building thier first cars

Jude Berthault
ETS FSAE
Steering System Leader
Brake System R&D
Montreal,Canada

[Blake_DFSAE]

Awesome, thanks.

Blake

[Blake_DFSAE]

Also, just as random question, is the Gixxer a common motor to use?

I see alot of talk about Honda motors but not so much on Suzuki

[Mark TMV]

We are also a first year team in Oshawa, ON aiming at entering the '07 competition. We've just purchased our 2nd Gixxer motor. It is somewhat suprising that there are very few teams using this type of engine, I wonder what is the reason for that.

The only other 'local' team using it is Guelph, and it seems to work rather nicely for them.

[Blake_DFSAE]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mark TMV:
We are also a first year team in Oshawa, ON aiming at entering the '07 competition. We've just purchased our 2nd Gixxer motor. It is somewhat suprising that there are very few teams using this type of engine, I wonder what is the reason for that.

The only other 'local' team using it is Guelph, and it seems to work rather nicely for them. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

At least you've got teams to help/visit.

The only other team in Atlantic Canada is Memorial

[Dave M]

We use gsxr's because thats what our sponsor gave us a few years ago. The gsxr's mounts are not equal on each side, which makes it difficult to stress the engine, but it still can be done. Its just easier with the others. The gsxr's still make good power though.

[Blake_DFSAE]

Yeah we picked ours up cheap off a wrecked bike.

One question - is it worth it to switch to electronically controlled fuel injection or is good carb tuning sufficient?

[Jersey Tom]

Isn't the GSX-R already EFI, stock?

[Blake_DFSAE]

not our 98

[Jersey Tom]

For you guys, might want to stick with carb then at least this year. Getting the car done, and having it reliable, is huge. Converting over to EFI would be a big move I'd think.

For next year you might try getting a more recent GSXR (or hell F4i, YZF..) that has EFI stock. Get that running, get that tuned out as best you can.

From there, if you want more fancy stuff, you can go with a standalone system.

Carb/FI has been hashed out before. Personally I, and I think most people around here, are all for EFI if its possible.

[Blake_DFSAE]

Yeah we plan to get the thing tuned reliably then start fucking around with EFI later

[Jersey Tom]

Just remember.. you get to competition, pass tech, and finish all the events and you could definately get top 1/3rd.

Easier said than done.

[Garbo]

Regarding EFI/carb:

I spent 4 years with Memorial's team. We worked on getting the engine (CBR 600 F2) to run with a carb but, due to the intake/restrictor rules, it is very hard and the best we got was a rough idle, no throttle response and a bunch of intakes chucked across the road.

My first time doing engine work, we bought the performance electronics ECU. I wired it up (first time wiring) and loaded the baseline 4 cylinder motorcycle engine maps from their website and the thing fired first shot and ran through the rev range fairly well. Tuning from there was easy.

Having tried both, I would highly recommend using a simple ECU and running fuel injection over trying to get a carb to work. Also, Performance Electronics has awesome customer support and will hold you hand through any problems you have. I think the ECU with all sensors we needed, etc. came in under $2000 CAD which was about 30% of our budget but well worth it!

Cheers,
Garbo
Memorial Seahawks Racing 2000-2004
Waterloo Motorsport 2005-2006

[Blake_DFSAE]

That's pretty damn awesome.

Although our budget isn't exactly large either, we're hoping to get it running really well as is.

At least for now anyways

[james17]

Granted we have a little experience, but our first time with the Performance Electronics system from the time the tape was cut off the top of the Performance Electronics box to the time the engine was running was around 4 hours. The unit is simple, easy to tune, and reliable, I'm actually an advocate of carbs in many situations but for a 12,000 RPM 4 valvle engine in a formula, theres no way to go but injection from what I've seen. We have an old car with carbs and they are nothing but trouble, and the motor will never rev right. Also, gear 85% of your effort towards just passing tech and driving the car some before the event, for a first year team nothing else matters.

[KU_Racing]

Hey Blake-
Good luck building your first FSAE car. My advice, from that designer and fabricator standpoint, is to strive for simplicity in every single aspect of your car. As a bunch of guys have already said, the most important thing early on is to complete every event and keep your car together. Many of the teams that fail are the ones that try to be too innovative- if you want to innovate, limit it to one system per season- that way you can still get everything done, as well we judging upgrades independantly.

[Michael Royce]

Blake,
You will find more good information on the offical SAE website at:
http://students.sae.org/competitions/formulaseries/

One of your biggest challenges will be organizing and managing your team. Therefore, I would highly recommend Dick Golembiewski's paper entitled "Managing Student Vehicle Projects". It is on the Formula page of the above site. There is also a link to the SAE Detroit Section's FSAE Workshop which has some other information that should help.

We look forward to seeing a Nova Scotia team at an event in 2007.

[Blake_DFSAE]

thanks, all the help is really appreciated

and if i have anything to do with it NS will be well represented.

Well let's just leave it at represented for now...