Waiting period

[Bill Kunst]

Is there any way that we could establish a wiating period, like when you buy a firearm, for new members. I think after they read through the first five posts on the forum that they could get the idea that they need to use the FIND tab rather than pissing off the people with good information by asking, "Could you tell me the answer to my obscure question? I haven't researched and don't want to design it."

I think when we get to the point that we have newbs starting posts about topics that already exist, some within the 1st page of topics, it has gone to far.

Back to the question at hand. Is it possible to create a waiting period? If not, could those of you who are directing your new team members here, give them a training session on how not to piss off the forum?

Sorry for the new topic, and rant
Bill

[Bill Kunst]

Is there any way that we could establish a wiating period, like when you buy a firearm, for new members. I think after they read through the first five posts on the forum that they could get the idea that they need to use the FIND tab rather than pissing off the people with good information by asking, "Could you tell me the answer to my obscure question? I haven't researched and don't want to design it."

I think when we get to the point that we have newbs starting posts about topics that already exist, some within the 1st page of topics, it has gone to far.

Back to the question at hand. Is it possible to create a waiting period? If not, could those of you who are directing your new team members here, give them a training session on how not to piss off the forum?

Sorry for the new topic, and rant
Bill

[Garlic]

Best solution IMO would be that one cannot create a new topic until you have 5 posts or so...

[Bill Kunst]

fantastic idea

[Mike Cook]

How about, I become the moderator and ban at will.

[Bill Kunst]

do you get to use your pistols?

[terra_dactile]

hello Bill & Company,

If these new members are asking such simple questions, then how is it that none of you guys are able to respond? If they are such stupid questions then why not try and help them constructively with there new found passion.

Second point, If you are going to blast someone at least have the balls to put down your name , which university you come from etc.. so we can go check out your cars and see if they are any good, that way your negative remarks might hold some backing,

This is my fourth year being involved with Formula SAE and i find that lots of members do not have any respect for those that are new to this forum, i agree that some time there are some really basic questions asked when there are already posts listed about the same topics, however what good does it do just wasting time being mean and cruel to them.
It has been mentioned lately that two years back this forum had alot more credibility, it is true, back in the day every one was more contructive and tried to help eachother out more.

Anyways feel free to blast me if you want but first go check out my teams cars, i'm sure if you were to come see us at competition or any other hi placed design team you would realize that being on the ball does not necessarly mean you have to be an ass with those that ask simple questions, Cornell, UWA, UTA, RMIT, Penn state, Waterloo etc.. all do very well in design every year but at the same time are very aproachable at competition even when very buissy.

Anyways im no expert i just am kind of fed up of all the negative energy on this forum, remember above all we are here to learn, sometime teaching other give you the possibility to better understand certain subjects.

Take care,

Jude Berthault
ETS FSAE 2003-Current
Vehicle Dynamics Leader

[Chris Allbee]

I don't think it is unreasonable to expect a certain amount of preparation or reading of past posts before asking a question on here.

[Mike Cook]

Jude, people should be able to use the search button. It's not like the internets were invented yesterday. I spend a ton of time with new kids, teaching them things. But why should I answer the same question over and over and over? I loose all patience when people won't learn to help themselves.

[RiNaZ]

I think it's not the problem of asking simple question, rather, it's how the simple question is being asked. I think both Bill and Jude has a point in their reasonings.

having been in this forum since it first started (and way before that; mailing list), i have to agree that improvement is needed with the way that members post comments/questions. By the way Mike Cook, i wish that was possible (none of the moderators have that option) http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

And i think respects go both ways in this forum. The newbies have got to use the search forum, and the seniors can at least show the link to the previous thread were and if the topic had already been discussed.

But in all honesty, if we didnt have all these posts from newbies, i do think that this forum will have its "silence-period". It had happened a lot before.

p/s: no complaints other than the 2 posts about carbon fibre wheels. You have to agree, it's just mind boggling to know that for someone who built a CF chassis can create the same topic which was discussed a day earlier and managed to say "these ppl come and go". Go figure.

[Bill Kunst]

Jude,
I think that we have to stop making excuses for the newbs' poor preparation. Why should anyone on this post have to do the searching for the newbs? You are saying that if the newb doesn't search, we should and then post that prior topic for them to read. Should we also read it to them. That IS the next step.

I teach students that are in high school. I, and other teachers, find that these excuses for people being lazy only encourages those behaviors. I don't think anyone is asking alot on this forum by expecting the newbs to do a LITTLE research and searching before they ask a question.

Bill

[Dave Cook]

How about a 'sticky' at the top like in other forums that instructs people to use the find feature and that also has a small paragraph declaring that the moderators will move obviously asked questions to some other topic folder.

Dave

[Superfast Matt McCoy]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bill Kunst:
Jude,
I think that we have to stop making excuses for the newbs' poor preparation. Why should anyone on this post have to do the searching for the newbs? You are saying that if the newb doesn't search, we should and then post that prior topic for them to read. Should we also read it to them. That IS the next step.

I teach students that are in high school. I, and other teachers, find that these excuses for people being lazy only encourages those behaviors. I don't think anyone is asking alot on this forum by expecting the newbs to do a LITTLE research and searching before they ask a question.

Bill </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

The questions you are talking about are not a problem on this forum, the problem is that any time anyone asks a question that you know the answer to, you and half the other people on the forum blast them with self-righteous posts filled with arrogant words like "newb". So now people are afraid to ask any question and the forum is filled with topics like this that have nothing to do with fsae. At least posts like "carbon fiber wheels" are about racecars. I don't think someone like you needs to be teaching forum etiquette since most of your posts not only completely lack any useful information, but are usually off topic rants.

No one is suggesting that you need to do forum searching for, as you call them "stupid fucks"� with "your head buried up your asses"�. If you don't like the post, ignore it. Or reply to it with a decent response. Even a "this topic was discussed previously, please use the search feature"� would be nice.

Remember, it takes half of a second to click the back button, but several minutes to make yourself look like an arrogant asshole.

[Wesley]

I understand that it is tiresome to answer the same questions over and over. If I have a question, I try to bring it to my teammates first and foremost - after all, they are the most knowledgeable about our car design.

I am a newbie on this forum, but I have belonged to other car-related forums for a long time. Because of their nature, there is an incredible amount of collective knowledge available, and this one is probably at the top of any I've frequented.

But often, posts that have been previously discussed are not as clear as they could be. While something might've been mentioned in a discussion, it's hard to draw important facts from a post that wasn't designed to answer your question.

I'm sure there are plenty of "hey whats the best way to make 4000 HP" posts, and I try to avoid making any posts that are inane, but, no offense, most of the engineering profession aren't writers. They say enough to get their point across in a given situation, and the rest is up to interpretation.

To be honest, some of us newbs know you guys know a ton of stuff, and want to soak it up. Sometimes we get a little excited and want to talk to people instead of reading Member X talk to Member Z about something related, but different than our own question.

And there's a difference between reading a book and interacting with people that know things. You get something out of the interaction that the books can't duplicate.

I agree, newbies should definitely try to do their research. But don't scare us off. We just want to be loved. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[Beatle]

How about if someone starts a thread that has already been discussed you just dont respond. The only topic I am sick of seeing on this forum is what to do about "newbs". I agree its annoying when a person asks what engine they should use or something like that, but thats why browsers have "back" buttons.

[drivetrainUW-Platt]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dave Cook:
How about a 'sticky' at the top like in other forums that instructs people to use the find feature and that also has a small paragraph declaring that the moderators will move obviously asked questions to some other topic folder.

Dave </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Exactly what I was thinking. I dont want police on here, but some of the neverending how do i build a formula car questions I could live without.

A new members section would be good to have too, so that they can get their feet wet somewheres before jumping in the ring with us 4 year fsae'ers

oh and I was wondering if you guys could help me with our car this year? I have a few questions:
what engine should we run
How do I design a suspension
sweet, I get a free turbo, thats a direct boltup right?
ect ect......

[Sam Zimmerman]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bill Kunst:
Pat,
I am new to the forum, but not to working on a team, or going back as an alumni to help support teams in tech and manufacturing expertise. I really think the main problem is that everyone wants instant gratification. Its like self pleasure without the work. I ask for the answer, someone hopefully replies with the right answer. No work for me, YEA!!

I find that many morons, from the states, have grown up on hondatunermycarisfastertech.com/forum and don't know how to search anywhere, which is evident within this site. Using dogpile, yahoo, google can get you most of the results you get here with less time and insult. Sure, we may never be able to find the directions on home to build a winning FSAE car on the net, but we can ask someone and they might just tell us.

So, to sum up this long post, laziness craps up this forum and almost all others out there.

My five cents,
Bill Kunst </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bill,

The above was one of your very first posts on this forum. You came on throwing insults and it has never stopped.

Perhaps you can be more understanding of the folks who come on here to seek the advice of other FSAE members. I did a search of your posts and I didn't see one that actually asked another member of this community for their help or advice on anything technical. I know it is very hard for you to understand, but there are people out there that do not know everything. The people who do not posses the all-encompassing knowledge that you do actually come here to both learn and share whatever knowledge their feeble little minds might posses. I am not sure why somebody who already knows everything would take their time to point their browser to FSAE.com. Could you enlighten me? If you have already covered this in a previous post, please accept my apologies as I must not be as proficient with the search feature as you are.

[Bill Kunst]

Sam,
I have been trying to figure out how to respond to this. I will just answer your question. I don't post a lot of questions, as I am not in the competition. I read what others have to say, ask questions under their topics, and try to provide help and suggestions (like this topic). I don't know all the answers, and have never pretended to. I do know how to search, as do you, and have done it many times for people. Sorry if you feel that this topic hurts feelings, or the forum, but I think it is important.
Bill

Oh yeah, I hope you didn't read through nine pages of the BS I posted.

[Chris Allbee]

Hey Bill....just go away.

[VFR750R]

Second to Bill going away...Man law.

[2 wheels > 4]

Some people just dont know how forum's work.

And I believe its tradition for new forum members to get grilled.

[Kyle Walther]

i believe ritual sacrifice was also a tradition. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

[Superfast Matt McCoy]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kyle Walther:
i believe ritual sacrifice was also a tradition. http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kyle, ritual sacrifice was discussed in a previous post. Please use the FIND feature.

[Wesley]

Matt, telling people to use the FIND feature was discussed in a previous post. Please use the FIND feature.

[Chris Allbee]

Wesley, I believe your mom has been previously discussed. Please use the FIND feature.

[Ian M]

I got a good laugh out of this one! Thanks guys!

[Sooner_Electrical]

Great guys, you got another person to laugh at us... again... this is the muff battle all over again... and the wing... no respect... Perhaps we should start using bigger words when we post, we will look smarter then.

[VFR750R]

Write with a british accenthttp://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[Sooner_Electrical]

That is a Bloody Brilliant Idea Mate! Then we could talk about our al-u-mie-num wheel centers and our Hoosier tyres. Rite-O!

Cheerio