jkaz
10-28-2009, 11:08 PM
Thanks to everyone for your interest in the Penske 7800 FSAE shock, especially those who have bought damper sets for your car.
Between phone calls, e-mails and the recent FSAE workshop in Detroit, people are asking a lot of the same questions about dampers and the Penske 7800 shock. To make it easier for everyone, we have put together a list of the mostly commonly asked questions, and will post them on this FSAE forum.
Please feel free to post any questions, ask for clarification, etc, etc. We will gladly answer your questions.
You can also write to us at FSAE_Shock@kaztechnologies.com
Thanks,
Jim Kasprzak
Kaz Technologies
jkaz@kaztechnologies.com
FAQ: I haven’t heard about the Penske 7800 FSAE shock. Where do I get information?
All the information about the new Penske 7800 FSAE shock is on the Kaz Technologies website, www.kaztechnologies.com (http://www.kaztechnologies.com). Below is the list of information:
Penske 7800 FSAE Shock Products Brochure
Penske 7800 FSAE Shock Technical Brochure
Penske 7800 FSAE Shock Order Form
50mm Stroke Damper Blueprint
50mm Stroke Damper CAD file
75mm Stroke Damper Blueprint
75mm Stroke Damper CAD file
FAQ What are the disadvantages of tuning your motion ration to achieve the desired damping?
There are several disadvantages, all related to the reduction of stroke by reducing the motion ratio. With a motion ratio of 1:1, the range of shock displacement on a FSAE car is approx. 1 inch, with typical velocities up to 5 in/sec. This is already a small amount of displacement, and relatively low velocities for a shock. With these small displacements, you have a small volume of oil moving through the valving. As you reduce the motion ratio, you reduce the displacement, thus reducing oil volume moving through the valves. Even worse, you reduce the velocities of the shock. This reduction in velocities and displacement means you are only using the low speed or bleed portion of the valving. This is not a very effect use of the shock, and, in this low velocity range, the adjusters in any shock are not very effective. So, what you want to do is use motion ratios of 1:1 or greater to get the best performance from your damper. If not, you will have a hard time making effective use of the dampers.
FAQ- Can I order the Penske 7800 FSAE shock in different lengths?
There are both 50mm and 75mm stroke versions available. The 50mm version allows for direct replacement with many of the mountain bike shocks currently used by teams. The 75mm version allows more flexibility when designing your motion ratios. Also, if you want to switch the length of your shock (say to change your suspension design for the next year), you can purchase replacement rods and tubes to convert the shocks without buying entirely new units.
FAQ- Is there a lower cost unit available?
We have been receiving many requests from teams for a lower cost shock. We are currently working with Penske to develop a lower cost version of the shock. This "lower cost" version will use the same external construction, but will not be adjustable. We are also investigating upgrade kits that would allow teams who are budget conscious to purchase the lower cost units, then purchase the parts upgrade them to adjustable units at a later date.
FAQ- Is performance data available for this Penske 7800 FSAE shock?
We are currently finalizing the valve codes for the four stock compression and rebound valving codes. We have spent time minimizing the hysteresis and maximizing the adjustment range for each code. We will be publishing the data for each of the four stock compression and rebound valve codes in the near future. One of these valve codes will be a good baseline for your FSAE car. The damping selection for your car is part of your suspension design and optimization process. We ask you to provide your vehicle’s specifications with your shock order so we can verify that your valve code selection is appropriate for your vehicle.
FAQ- How did this shock come into existence?
The design and development of the Penske 7800 is a joint project between Kaz Technologies and Penske Racing Shocks. The shock was specifically designed for FSAE cars. The shock includes special design features such as changeable canister orientation and clockable canister. The design uses pistons and valving from the Penske F1 line of shocks.
FAQ- Can a team rebuild or revalve this damper themselves?
Yes,. As with all Penske shocks, the 7800 FSAE shock can be rebuilt and revalved by teams with minimal tools. All tools and valving parts are available from Kaz Technologies. The Penske design does not need an "evac and fill" machine to rebuild. Kaz Technologies also provides both rebuild and revalving services for your FSAE shocks.
FAQ- Can we change the reservoir orientation or clocking ourselves?
Yes. The assembly orientation of the bridge dictates the reservoir orientation. You will need to be able to disassemble the shock and reassemble with the desired orientation and clocking.
FAQ- Can we order replacement parts for this unit?
Although we hope that you never have to, yes you can order replacement parts for the shock. There is a bill of materials (BOM) print for each of the shocks These list part numbers for each of parts in the shock. We understand that things happen and replacement parts need to be ordered.
FAQ- Will Kaz Technologies sponsor our team with a set of shocks?
Unfortunately, we are a relatively small company just beginning to sell this product. Currently the sales volume is just not enough to support team sponsorship. However, we are providing free shock seminars at each of the events we attend, and will soon begin publishing a series of technical papers on shock absorbers and suspension tuning that will be available on our website.
Between phone calls, e-mails and the recent FSAE workshop in Detroit, people are asking a lot of the same questions about dampers and the Penske 7800 shock. To make it easier for everyone, we have put together a list of the mostly commonly asked questions, and will post them on this FSAE forum.
Please feel free to post any questions, ask for clarification, etc, etc. We will gladly answer your questions.
You can also write to us at FSAE_Shock@kaztechnologies.com
Thanks,
Jim Kasprzak
Kaz Technologies
jkaz@kaztechnologies.com
FAQ: I haven’t heard about the Penske 7800 FSAE shock. Where do I get information?
All the information about the new Penske 7800 FSAE shock is on the Kaz Technologies website, www.kaztechnologies.com (http://www.kaztechnologies.com). Below is the list of information:
Penske 7800 FSAE Shock Products Brochure
Penske 7800 FSAE Shock Technical Brochure
Penske 7800 FSAE Shock Order Form
50mm Stroke Damper Blueprint
50mm Stroke Damper CAD file
75mm Stroke Damper Blueprint
75mm Stroke Damper CAD file
FAQ What are the disadvantages of tuning your motion ration to achieve the desired damping?
There are several disadvantages, all related to the reduction of stroke by reducing the motion ratio. With a motion ratio of 1:1, the range of shock displacement on a FSAE car is approx. 1 inch, with typical velocities up to 5 in/sec. This is already a small amount of displacement, and relatively low velocities for a shock. With these small displacements, you have a small volume of oil moving through the valving. As you reduce the motion ratio, you reduce the displacement, thus reducing oil volume moving through the valves. Even worse, you reduce the velocities of the shock. This reduction in velocities and displacement means you are only using the low speed or bleed portion of the valving. This is not a very effect use of the shock, and, in this low velocity range, the adjusters in any shock are not very effective. So, what you want to do is use motion ratios of 1:1 or greater to get the best performance from your damper. If not, you will have a hard time making effective use of the dampers.
FAQ- Can I order the Penske 7800 FSAE shock in different lengths?
There are both 50mm and 75mm stroke versions available. The 50mm version allows for direct replacement with many of the mountain bike shocks currently used by teams. The 75mm version allows more flexibility when designing your motion ratios. Also, if you want to switch the length of your shock (say to change your suspension design for the next year), you can purchase replacement rods and tubes to convert the shocks without buying entirely new units.
FAQ- Is there a lower cost unit available?
We have been receiving many requests from teams for a lower cost shock. We are currently working with Penske to develop a lower cost version of the shock. This "lower cost" version will use the same external construction, but will not be adjustable. We are also investigating upgrade kits that would allow teams who are budget conscious to purchase the lower cost units, then purchase the parts upgrade them to adjustable units at a later date.
FAQ- Is performance data available for this Penske 7800 FSAE shock?
We are currently finalizing the valve codes for the four stock compression and rebound valving codes. We have spent time minimizing the hysteresis and maximizing the adjustment range for each code. We will be publishing the data for each of the four stock compression and rebound valve codes in the near future. One of these valve codes will be a good baseline for your FSAE car. The damping selection for your car is part of your suspension design and optimization process. We ask you to provide your vehicle’s specifications with your shock order so we can verify that your valve code selection is appropriate for your vehicle.
FAQ- How did this shock come into existence?
The design and development of the Penske 7800 is a joint project between Kaz Technologies and Penske Racing Shocks. The shock was specifically designed for FSAE cars. The shock includes special design features such as changeable canister orientation and clockable canister. The design uses pistons and valving from the Penske F1 line of shocks.
FAQ- Can a team rebuild or revalve this damper themselves?
Yes,. As with all Penske shocks, the 7800 FSAE shock can be rebuilt and revalved by teams with minimal tools. All tools and valving parts are available from Kaz Technologies. The Penske design does not need an "evac and fill" machine to rebuild. Kaz Technologies also provides both rebuild and revalving services for your FSAE shocks.
FAQ- Can we change the reservoir orientation or clocking ourselves?
Yes. The assembly orientation of the bridge dictates the reservoir orientation. You will need to be able to disassemble the shock and reassemble with the desired orientation and clocking.
FAQ- Can we order replacement parts for this unit?
Although we hope that you never have to, yes you can order replacement parts for the shock. There is a bill of materials (BOM) print for each of the shocks These list part numbers for each of parts in the shock. We understand that things happen and replacement parts need to be ordered.
FAQ- Will Kaz Technologies sponsor our team with a set of shocks?
Unfortunately, we are a relatively small company just beginning to sell this product. Currently the sales volume is just not enough to support team sponsorship. However, we are providing free shock seminars at each of the events we attend, and will soon begin publishing a series of technical papers on shock absorbers and suspension tuning that will be available on our website.