2018 FSAE Michigan

[JayNoon]

Let’s get this party started.

Things to look forward to at FSAE-M 2018:
- Endurace lap length extended by ~25% so more cars can fit on the track, may include a bit of the banking from the speedway. Added length will also be more challenging for drivers to memorize.
- Note: photo area will be eliminated and test area is moved. No one will be able to leave from the back gate while endurance is going on!
- FSAE app launches to improve spectator experience and aid teams.
- 2nd year of the 710cc rules. See if any teams try capitalize on larger disp.
- 2nd year of all dynamic events open on Friday.

Returning Top 10:
001 - Stuttgart (seems like it’s their comp to lose)
002 - GFR (will challenge for the overall win)
003 - TUG (will also challenge for the top)
005 - Michigan (Turbo power could unseat the Germans)
006 - San Jose (Triumph Triple, no replacement for displacement!)
007 - Minnesota (Newcomers to the Top 10, Amazing finish last year, can they repeat?)
008 - Cornell (More turbo power, defending accel champs, could challenge for the podium)
009 - RIT (A sophisticated package, with some luck they could move up)
010 - Wisconsin (Consistent strong team, big power to weight, might be their year.)

And of course many other teams that had bad luck last year are contenders for the top spots.

Planning to post links to photos, videos and results in this thread. Keep your eyes open.

[mech5496]

Thanks for the heads up and appreciate giving feedback to the forums, as everyone seems to have mitigated to social media nowadays. Any live streams planned?

[DougMilliken]

Design finalists announced -- see http://results.fsaeonline.com/

[Scott Monash]

Any links to timing or results?

[JayNoon]

Results are all at the link above. Copied here: http://results.fsaeonline.com

Dynamics day 1 was characterized by very cold temperatures (40 F) and on-and-off rain and slush. The rain started 15 minutes after the autoX opened, and peaked around lunch time. The tracks slowly dried throughout the afternoon resulting in rapidly dropping lap times in eatery event. Stuttgart timed their final run perfectly with a 49s on a drying track, while Graz was caught out by rain immediately after, which impacted their time and a 52s was the best they could muster for second place.

Expecting more rain and frigid temperature tomorrow during endurance. Should be mayhem.

[JayNoon]

Endurance has been red-flagged halfway through the morning group due to lightning. Will resume tbd.

[tim_pattinson]

Preliminary results...
http://results.fsaeonline.com/OverallResults.aspx

Rennteam (no suprises),TU Graz, Valencia (FSUPV), TuFast, ETS as top 5

GFR not making it out in time for endurance, some controversy there? Inside story here (https://www.reddit.com/r/FSAE/comments/8iz0y9/so_uh_ujbswiftus_what_happened_to_gfr/dyvx8jr/)

New hairpin also caused dramas, there's a 30 minute roundup here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkYIA1YrsWU) and also a short video showing the traffic effect (https://www.reddit.com/r/FSAE/comments/8iyny0/michigan_hairpin_mayhem/) and causing the (rumored) loss of a nosecone and front wing, and also two front wing endplates causing DNF's


Disclaimer: In Australia, just observing over the net. Anyone who attended want to chime in?

[Michael Royce]

When I saw the layout of the Endurance track for MIS, I wondered how many teams would be caught out by that hairpin. It is well within the Rules (Hairpin Turns in D8.6.2)!

The Rules Committee put that in many year ago after we had problems at FS UK Endurance track at Bruntingthorpe, with cars not making the turn from the "hard standing" onto the go kart track. There was no way we could change that track, so put in a "flag" in the rules that the cars should be able to make a turn around a single cone pylon with a 4.5 metre wide track. i.e. a turning circle OD of 9 metres. It appears that quite a number of teams have not taken that turning circle requirement into account in their car design.

Methinks that will change.

[js10coastr]

https://youtu.be/YlP4GX-SOd4

The key points to getting around the hairpin being

1) Hand out the window
2) Door open
3) Taking a drink of water

[Pat Clarke]

[QUOTE Michael Royce]
I wondered how many teams would be caught out by that hairpin.

I think what has happened is this...

The 'Monkey see, monkey do' habit that has developed, teams determine (with no good justification) that
you must have a tricky (read 'very expensive') steering rack, 10" wheels and a bucket full of Ackermann
steering geometry. These parameters often lead to the steering linkage going over-centre before sufficient
lock has been achieved. But, that's okay because there is never a tight hairpin on the course...is there?

There is a very tight hairpin in Austria and a sequence of two in Italy. Probably several more, so don't
waste too much time wondering why the Euro teams generally had no problem with the hairpin.

On the negative side of the argument, it sure made a mess of the Endurance run, hassled the course workers
and generated some dangerous situations.

But as Michael has commented. Things will change, after all FSAE is an educational exercise.

Pat

[mech5496]

We have learned our lesson in Italy, in 2013. We always design around that rule, and always check that too once we have a rolling chassis; however that year the diff was set up too tight to suit the drivers' preferences. The car was able to do both with a bit of oversteer, but not in a standing pace that was implied by other cars slowing down too much for these hairpins, thus leading to a black flag. From that point onwards, the cars can make it through 2 consecutive minimum radius ones with 30cm or so to spare.

[MCoach]

We have learned our lesson in Italy, in 2013. We always design around that rule, and always check that too once we have a rolling chassis; however that year the diff was set up too tight to suit the drivers' preferences. The car was able to do both with a bit of oversteer, but not in a standing pace that was implied by other cars slowing down too much for these hairpins, thus leading to a black flag. From that point onwards, the cars can make it through 2 consecutive minimum radius ones with 30cm or so to spare.


I don't enjoy when the minimum turn radius is used. It's not fun to drive, it's not fun to watch, and the only people who like it are those who want to throw a "gotcha" out there just to make sure you're paying attention.
This is especially with regard to cars that are designed to work well at balanced force steer conditions but may not operate well at all at parking lot, geometric steer conditions.

[DougMilliken]

It's not fun to drive, it's not fun to watch, ...
Perhaps offer style/bonus points to everyone that "drifts" around the pin turn?
[note, I'm not being completely serious here, but this might generate some discussion?]

[js10coastr]

I don't enjoy when the minimum turn radius is used. It's not fun to drive, it's not fun to watch, and the only people who like it are those who want to throw a "gotcha" out there just to make sure you're paying attention.
This is especially with regard to cars that are designed to work well at balanced force steer conditions but may not operate well at all at parking lot, geometric steer conditions.

But does it matter if it's not fun to drive or watch? FSAE isn't really in the market for viewers and/or paying drivers.

That being said, I do love watching (and hearing) indycars come around the hairpin at the Long Beach GP, and then accelerate down the straight.

[Drew Price]

That being said, I do love watching (and hearing) indycars come around the hairpin at the Long Beach GP, and then accelerate down the straight.


I like it when the CanAm cars come around it even better....

[BillCobb]

My best memories are watching right in front of you an F1 car approching a small radius turn at maximum decel. You are in dis-belief that the car is seems to be going WAY too fast to even survive the turn. It's a play on your stereotype of what vehicle physics can and can not do. TV doesn't begin to show you the effect because the depth of field is to short.