2015 Formula Student UK

[mech5496]

With the competition is around the corner, how's everyone doing? Any live feeds this year? Keep the updates coming!

[BeunMan]

Anybody found the event booklet online already? Racecar engineering used to do it but it's not there for 2015 and I haven't seen any other info except for crappy excel to pdf conversions.

[BeunMan]

Some info
Schedule: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CJZJ29SXAAAI7yB.jpg:large

Thumbs and image resize don't seem to work ...

[ausracing]

https://www.facebook.com/RacecarEngineering?fref=ts
https://www.facebook.com/FStotal?fref=ts
https://twitter.com/FSUKLive

The FSUK live has updates on everyone on everything, can make it hard to follow any one team.

Any news on live footage? If not, can someone there raise it for the future? Baja, FSAE-A and FSG do it, and given the UK event has a lot of international teams it would be highly appreciated.

Also is there someone on the ground that can provide insights (weather/innovative designs/track layout)?

Booklet by Racecar Eng
http://www.racecar-engineering.com/formulastudent/

[BeunMan]

...
Booklet by Racecar Eng
http://www.racecar-engineering.com/formulastudent/

I can only see the one from last year (and the cars for this year).

Miki will probably be updating from FSUK starting tomorrow, just as Stef, so I'll expect some info from there. @FSUKLive is sketchy at best, like previous years. Hopefully they connect the speaker to radio silverstone (but I haven't found any stream yet), but considering last years (yes plural) 'non-there' availability it probably won't happen.

Maybe Erik Schmidt (he's there @FStroopwafel) can tell something about the tracklayout.

[Z]

Booklet by Racecar Eng
http://www.racecar-engineering.com/formulastudent/
I see ~48 Teams there (Class 1), with quite a few of them looking as if they might not even run (given the sloppiness of their spec sheets).

Is this right? I thought FSUK was bigger?

(Edit: Just checked, and 100 Teams in each of 2013 and 2014... So what happened this year?)

Z

[Freddie]

I see ~48 Teams there (Class 1), with quite a few of them looking as if they might not even run (given the sloppiness of their spec sheets).

Is this right? I thought FSUK was bigger?

(Edit: Just checked, and 100 Teams in each of 2013 and 2014... So what happened this year?)

Z

Something must have happend with the booklet, there are approximately 100-120 cars here and while there will probably be hectic for some to pass scrutineering in order to score in all dynamic events, it's not as it looks like in that booklet.

[BeunMan]

I am parsing the FSUKlive timings into text files:
http://famtimmermans.net/fs/fsuk2013/skidpad.txt
http://famtimmermans.net/fs/fsuk2013/accel.txt
http://famtimmermans.net/fs/fsuk2013/autox.txt
With 'indicative' scoring.


Full data http://famtimmermans.net/fs/fsuk2013/data.txt

Don't mind the fsuk2013, it just an old directory which I'm reusing. Data is from 2015 twitter feed of @FSUKLive with some RegEx magic and a python parser.

[BeunMan]

Design finalists: Zürich, greenteam, revolve, kit-e, oxford, Delft
Cost 'finalists': https://twitter.com/FormulaStudent/status/619897809530175489/photo/1
Business finalists: Delft, Aberdeen, Liverpool.

Kit-C crashed into the tires (apparently heavy), driver ok as far as I heard.
And Hannover's battery pack went up in flames.

Business:
https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/11709615_10153384167291427_4288753173409789191_n.j pg?oh=27931ea6a44397b827a13d6b666aefc7&oe=56293C06&dl=1
https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/11707588_10153384168606427_7525148611215733724_n.j pg?oh=9bd7f635afa16760c4ca9a2c4f6abae8&oe=561A911B&dl=1

Cost:
https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/11707629_10153384166361427_3247011718992790158_n.j pg?oh=cb3a04f72970c452f530c47fb863e1ec&oe=561F688C&dl=1

Autox:
2 Times 50.342 49.317 49.794 48.934 0 0 150.000 Rennteam Uni Stuttgart
26 Times 51.314 49.045 51.311 49.925 0 0 148.961 GreenTeam Uni Stuttgart e.V.
33 Times 52.483 52.008 51.146 49.348 0 0 146.148 AMZ Racing
1 Times 55.605 53.341 50.415 49.929 0 0 140.850 Formula Student Team Delft
91 Times 53.063 50.921 52.078 50.448 0 0 136.220 TU Graz Racing Team
31 Times 54.053 51.794 50.881 50.515 0 0 135.629 TUfast Racing Team
131 Times 55.691 53.606 74.768 51.516 0 0 126.986 TUfast e-Technology
96 Times 55.668 54.53 54.626 52.947 0 0 115.198 WHZ Racing Team
23 Times 61.885 55.449 55.41 53.095 0 0 114.016 Running Snail Racing Team
3 Times 56.004 54.53 0 0 0 0 102.879 KA-RaceIng C
6 Times 58.998 55.989 56.033 54.614 0 0 102.245 Oxford Brookes Racing
8 Times 0 77.13 54.648 55.901 0 0 101.989 Revolve NTNU
41 Times 62.463 57.165 57.663 55.319 0 0 97.002 Lund University Formula Student Engineering
7 Times 59.122 57.455 57.709 55.763 0 0 93.768 Team Bath Racing
149 Times 59.515 55.776 60.149 56.882 0 0 93.674 UBRacing
64 Times 64.155 60.506 60.527 57.035 0 0 84.782 LJMU Racing Team
18 Times 59.151 57.318 65.281 83.608 0 0 82.837 UH Racing
17 Times 59.328 57.641 60.198 57.703 0 0 80.640 LUMotorsport
93 Times 66.463 61.525 59.911 57.931 0 0 78.689 TEAM SURTES
99 Times 0 0 82.634 58.06 0 0 77.827 Ecurie Aix Formula Student Team RWTH Aachen e.V.
15 Times 63.202 58.409 61.504 58.496 0 0 75.515 University of Strathclyde Motorsport
158 Times 59.189 59.595 62.499 61.79 0 0 70.445 ISAT Formula Team
81 Times 66.411 60.074 65.276 63.728 0 0 64.853 Ecurie Piston Sport Auto
42 Times 69.601 0 64.371 61.917 0 0 53.720 TU Darmstadt Racing Team e.V.
9 Times 67.031 63.37 0 0 0 0 45.400 Cardiff Racing
51 Times 66.015 0 69.851 64.094 0 0 41.394 Team HARE
83 Times 88.427 74.99 64.468 66.802 0 0 39.361 Formula UEM
16 Times 86.111 64.526 72.985 0 0 0 39.047 UCL Racing
46 Times 67.173 64.617 70.515 65.346 0 0 38.557 Mobil 1 Team Sussex
161 Times 65.654 89.867 67.241 64.918 0 0 36.945 MMU Racing
38 Times 65.306 0 0 0 0 0 34.888 TAU Racing
97 Times 78.989 72.145 79.084 69.871 0 0 12.410 Leeds Formula Race Team
48 Times 74.729 0 107.448 70.638 0 0 8.918 Formula Student Bizkaia
67 Times 74.368 71.189 97.711 87.742 0 0 6.456 University of Wolverhampton Racing

Pictures by Miki Hegedus.

[JulianH]

Thanks for your updates Tristan, the Text-Files were awesome!

Apparently Rennteam had a cone in the fastest lap, so Greenteam wins Sprint.

According to our quick calculation, Delft and Zurich are in the lead, depending on the Design and Business finals. Behind them the two Munich cars (-41 for the Electric, -55 for the Combustion).
Looks like a couple of teams in the mix for the Overall competition and the two Stuttgart teams with nothing to lose in the Endurance. Gonna be fun!

[BeunMan]

And the starting order:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CJp3uAvUYAAFLPz.jpg

[BeunMan]

Apparently some results won't take weeks this year:

http://events.imeche.org/formula-student/2015-results

And prelim. autoX:
https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/11694796_10152890317565766_4572283573869675509_n.j pg?oh=d67a2e096213f2c4817c978b1884523f&oe=56185B09&dl=1

Totals:


See a few posts down.

[ausracing]

Thanks for the updates Tristan! Excited to hear about enduro!

Would like to know what happened with KIT-c 's crash.
Last year (and years before that) the tyres and marshalling points have been on the outside of the track in the line of braking. If something like a wishbone was to break during braking then it would be worse as you would hit the tyres as well.
I brought this up with the event captain last year, so be interested to see the track and what happened to kit.
These views are my own not the team but there is a FSUK safety concern Facebook page where others have expressed similar views.
Auscomp was similar except the tyres were much bigger and scarier. A number of teams expressed their concerns there as well. Everyone still went flat-stick around the track but it is a bit unnerving in a fsae car which only has front and side impact structures, not' slightly to the left as you try and turn away' impact structures . Soon as you step into the car, the thought of something breaking in such locations is forgotten, otherwise cars would just cruise around.
Should probably be in another thread, might start one for general safety.

[BeunMan]

Endurance lap times: http://famtimmermans.net/fs/fsuk2013/endurance.txt

Please note: FSUKLive lacks some data and untill someone completes the endurance I can't add total time :)

[BeunMan]

Design score (tnx to Miki):
https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtp1/v/t1.0-9/11709567_10153385417541427_2695232730055370145_n.j pg?oh=205470ec9ebde0dece0063899c2a3929&oe=56287C84&dl=1

[JurrienK]

Setting all design finalists on 145 points, these are the totals before endurance:



max max 50+75+150+75+100+150=600
33 AMZ 524.84
1 Delft 523.20
96 Zwickau 447.73
26 Greenteam 445.07
2 Rennteam 441.79
8 Revolve 440.49
3 KIT c 439.96
23 Running Snail 435.53
131 Tufast E 433.56
31 TUfast C 432.96
6 Oxford Brookes 409.78
32 Wroclaw 409.57
91 TU Graz 409.15
18 Hertfordshire 396.82
41 Lund 391.99
7 Bath 381.71


Interesting to see that Greenteam missing skidpad and Rennteam missing skidpad and acceleration, still have the possibility of a podium finish (assuming AMZ and Delft finish endurance)

[BeunMan]

It might even be getting interesting:

https://scontent-ams3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t1.0-9/11214095_10200712627934875_8931981574009616655_n.j pg?oh=1c928fb2bb091cfe229f295770921456&oe=5656C3E1&dl=1

[BeunMan]

The rain has killed the timing (or at least @FSUKlive) ...

[BeunMan]

Preliminary Endurance with known results:
1. Bath
2. Delft
3. PWR Racing
4. LUMotorsport
5. Rennteam (stuttgart C)
6. Oxford

One problem: Zwickau, TU Munchen E and Lund drove most dry and had to switch so they will probably end up in the top 6 in place of some of the ones here now as they were still for at least 700 seconds...

Heavy showers after 70% of Zwickau's course, Bath, PWR, Lu and Oxford drove in dry, top-5 autoX drove in >= "wet". AMZ, GreenTeam and Graz Retired, just as TU Munchen C.

Note: This is including driver change, tire change, no cones/OCs etc. So expect changes (or wait till someone actually calculates the values)

[BeunMan]

Prediction by Jurrien with efficiency (blatantly copied from facebook)

Jurrien Koeman Mijn voorspelling:
1 Delft 895 punten
2 Zwickau 845 punten
3 Rennteam 770 punten

[mech5496]

Any info on retirements cause? Seems that DNF rates were pretty high once more..

[JulianH]

Zurich had an IMD fault 1,5 laps from finish.

[BeunMan]

Do you have any idea about the laptimes they were doing? FSUKLive decided it wasn't important enough to show them of most of the top-5


And the results:

http://events.imeche.org/formula-student/2015-results

[ausracing]

Rennteam were posting laptimes on their twitter.
Rain certainly made a difference then! Congrats to Delft, Zwickau and Rennteam on the top placings!

[Z]

Zurich had an IMD fault 1,5 laps from finish.
Julian,

That is most unfortunate ... they were going so well, 1st in Design, Acc, SP, and very fast in AutoX!

But something seems a bit funny with the scoring, with Zurich receiving NO points at all for Enduro? Other non-finishers still scored some points, so have their times showing?

And why only 149 points for 1st place in Design?

And what is an "IMD"?

Z

[ritwikdas18]

Insulation Monitoring Device.
679

[BeunMan]

Julian,
...
And why only 149 points for 1st place in Design?

Thats FSUK alright. Top5 get 13[0/5]+ points and then have to fight in the finals for the rest.



But something seems a bit funny with the scoring, with Zurich receiving NO points at all for Enduro? Other non-finishers still scored some points, so have their times showing?
....

... ... ... I was wrong, See posts lower down. They should be in the results.

The times I got were 66ish seconds for AMZ in the beginning when stuttgart was doing 68s and Delft 64s, but nothing official. The timing stopped, and so did the reports I got after a few laps.

[JulianH]

Z,

yes, it was a shame to fail so close to the finish. I haven't heard from them but probably a bit of water got into the motors, that was usually our problem in the last years in heavy rain.

The Design Scoring in the UK is not always stretched to 150 points. I think we won Design back in 2013 also without the full points. Maybe because there is no perfect Design Event ;)

I'm especially impressed with the SkidPad time of Zurich. It was the first event ever for the driver and he was a whopping whole tenth faster than any SkidPad time at a FSAE competition in the world ever. As far as I know, the "World Record" was a 4,733s from GFR at FSA last year.
And the car was not equipped with the planned Rear Wheel Steer because it was a bit unstable at high speeds.
Accel was a bit disappointing for the Electric cars, but the 60kW limit in the UK is really low...


I got the message that Zurich was faster than Delft in the second stint, so I guess it would have been close. But that does not count.

Hopefully the guys will get back on their feet and we are going to see an amazing FSG with Zurich, Delft, Greenteam Stuttgart, Karlsruhe and Munich battling it out!


Congrats to Delft. Once again, a nearly perfect competition. Impressive.

[Z]

Hopefully the guys will get back on their feet and we are going to see an amazing FSG with Zurich, Delft, Greenteam Stuttgart, Karlsruhe and Munich battling it out!

Ahh yes... definitely an advantage of living in Europe. So many FS comps to go to! :)

Good luck to all!

(And let's see some more World Records broken!)

Z

[Z]

I can't find the You-Tube links right now, but interesting to note in Acceleration;

* ETH-Zurich had 4WD, ~60 kW, and time of 3.724s (FSUK 2015).
* ECU (W-Oz) had 2WD, ~60 kW, and time of 3.80?s (FSAE-Oz 2014).

So well under 1/10 second difference. And much better times to come from ECU...

But most importantly...

... give me the combustion engine's exhaust note anytime ... over those horrible whining electric motors with their cross-cut-teeth gearboxes!!!

Julian, please, ... that is simply not socially responsible! :)

Z

[TMichaels]

Triggering an IMD generally equals DSQ for that part of the event or No listing in the scores (like FSUK did) as far as I know.

No, that's wrong. I have not checked the FS UK rules ammendments, but the kind of failure does not make any difference for scoring. Therefore it is a scoring hiccup in my opinion.

[JulianH]

But most importantly...

... give me the combustion engine's exhaust note anytime ... over those horrible whining electric motors with their cross-cut-teeth gearboxes!!!

Julian, please, ... that is simply not socially responsible! :)

Z

That's why we are using straight-cut-teeth gearboxes ;)

On a more serious note, I guess all the 4WD electric cars were not up to speed in Accel (the point advantage is quite low, so you are more focussing on the big 150 points in AutoCross).
I guess Stuttgart-Delft-Zurich would be able to run 3,5s with the 60kW. We saw a 3,210 in Italy 2013 (ok it was Italy..) from Zurich and a 3,359 from Stuttgart at FSG last year.
I look forward to see the performance of Wroclaw in Germany, they have a real oldschool 4-cylinder car without wings and ran also 3,8's in Accel. They are going to crush the combustion class in Germany ;)

[BeunMan]

No, that's wrong. I have not checked the FS UK rules ammendments, but the kind of failure does not make any difference for scoring. Therefore it is a scoring hiccup in my opinion.
Sorry, I was wrong (Can't find it in the rules anywhere, I made a mistake by accepting the over-power violations the same is IMD triggers, which clearly have nothing to do with each other)!


Hmm, than it is just strange. The other teams seem to have had their scores. They aren't in any of the official results for Endurance (which are on the website of fsuk)

[Michael Royce]

Could it be a violation of EV2.2? That would lead to a DQ.

[TMichaels]

Could it be a violation of EV2.2? That would lead to a DQ.
A power violation was indeed the reason as I was made aware.