WOT Shifting

[Wolverine_1987]

Hello guys, does anybody know anything about WOT ( wide open throttle ) shifting technique and is it like "legal" in FSAE 2010 competitions ? and what about using turbochargers as well ?

[Wolverine_1987]

Hello guys, does anybody know anything about WOT ( wide open throttle ) shifting technique and is it like "legal" in FSAE 2010 competitions ? and what about using turbochargers as well ?

[D Collins Jr]

Read the Rules. They're on the sae site. Under Rules.

[Hector]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by D Collins Jr:
Read the Rules. They're on the sae site. Under Rules. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
This, this, a thousand times this.

[exFSAE]

Not sure how you'd shift at WOT with an unmodified sportbike engine.. gotta unload the gearbox somehow..

[flavorPacket]

We had no-lift shifting for 08 and 09. It's not terribly complex: you put a strain gauge on the shifter and have the ECU cut torque as the shifter gets pulled and then ramp back in as the next gear engages. Can't really do it with a Motec, though.

[PBnG]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by exFSAE:
Not sure how you'd shift at WOT with an unmodified sportbike engine.. gotta unload the gearbox somehow.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oxidizer + fuel + ignition = boom. Take away any one of these and the engine will suffer no boom condition.



For good measure: BOOM!

[RenM]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by flavorPacket:
Can't really do it with a Motec, though. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ignition cut for upshift....

[woodsy96]

Are you a first year team? If so I believe your time would be better spent on making a simple running car that will get through the comp than worrying about flat shifting.

Our past cars have had flat shifting, an it has all been controlled through the ECU (Autronic). We run an electronic shifter though so it is resonably easy to set up as opposed to a mechanical shifter (though I suppose you could use a button/microswitch instead of a strain gauge).

[Pennyman]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RenM:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by flavorPacket:
Can't really do it with a Motec, though. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ignition cut for upshift.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

THIS

(BTW, power commander has a quick shift module that works very nicely http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif)

[flavorPacket]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RenM:
ignition cut for upshift.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

We've done it with a Motec, but it's not nearly as smooth. Or fast.

[Fred G]

Fuel cut?

[Jon Oneill]

In the past 3 years we used a pneumatic shift system without shift cut. This year, we set up the ignition cut system using the motec M400, allowing us to flat shift without any problems. Using our current system, we're able to complete an upshift in about 180ms without much trouble.

[TMG24]

Ditto to JonJon. We did the same thing in 09. There are a million ways to cut power to shift. Start with the basics: Fuel and Spark.

Do your homework.

[Mikey Antonakakis]

Cutting spark tends to make flames shoot out of your exhaust. Which I like. vrooooooooooOOOOOOMMMkaPOPOPOPvrooooooooOOOOOOOM

[Fred G]

Cutting fuel earns fuel economy points...

*yawn...*

Boring, bring on the flames!

Fred

[mech5107]

Don't do it, if it's your 1st car.

Train the driver properly to instantly lift when up shifting and blipping when down shifting.

If you go on, i would go with ignition cut...safer for the engine.

[RenM]

If u are using a motec for example its perfectly easy to set up the ignition cut if you have bought the feature.
It makes driving easier and i dont see why a reasonable long ignition cut could harm the engine.

If, because of some odd reason, the ignition cut does not work you can still tell the driver to lift....

[Wolverine_1987]

Thank you guysAlexandria University, Egypt (AUMotorsports Suspension member)

[dazz]

You could always just hold pressure on the gear lever and wait for the rev limiter... http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif (assuming your ECU is setup with a limiter)

If you are a first year team, keep everything as simple as possible to give the best chance of actually completing the car and making it to comp. Go for a really neat and clean design and don't worry about complex electronics and gadgetry. I would recommend using the same clutch actuation that is standard on your engine and either a linkage or cable operated shift lever. Good luck with your build.

[M3Shark]

I thought you were not allowed to use fuel cut because it fell under the "no electronic throttle control" rule...

I guess i must have been wrong...

[Hector]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M3Shark:
I thought you were not allowed to use fuel cut because it fell under the "no electronic throttle control" rule...

I guess i must have been wrong... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
The ability to use fuel cut cannot cause a runaway car scenario, which is why the rule is there.

The concern with electronic throttling is on the throttle-body end of things. They don't want someone's fly-by-wire throttle to do weird things or stick open and put the car through a wall. I've seen enough sparky stuff go wrong in my day that I think this is a pretty good rule...

[Wolverine_1987]

Thanks guys... i think i knew what should i do



AUMotorsports Team Member 2010
Alexandria University, Egypt.

[RollingCamel]

Yeah, like focusing on your exams? :P

[Wolverine_1987]

Guess so yeah http://fsae.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_razz.gif



AUMotorsports Team member 2010
Alexandria University, Egypt.