Mr Riley,

I have been searching through the materials list and cannot find "Solid Axle" listed on there. I know an AIR was submitted a while ago, but should I just cost this as made seeing as it didn't make the list?

I also noticed that specifically fuel injection and air induction systems are not included in the cost of the engine. Just to clarify, should we be costing the exhaust out as well? It makes sense to, but I wanted to check seeing as a good amount of equipment is included in that engine cost.

Are we supposed to cost external threading using a die under Threading, External (Machining) or could it just be considered a variation of tapping?

Also, is there an entry for plain roller bearings? I see tapered roller and thrust needle, but no plain roller.

I never did get an answer on jackscrews either. Should I submit an AIR or just cost them as if we made them?

Chris: I'm working on AIR's right now but not everything is going to make it. The answer on the solid axle is going to be cost it as made. The bearings and other purchased items are probably already in the materials table. Exhaust should be cost as made and is not included in the engine cost.

Michael: I'm not sure when, but I added "Threading, External" and "Threading, Internal" some time ago to the process table. Make sure you have the latest version. That can be used for machining threads. A 'normal' ball bearing is listed as "Bearing, Ball, Radial". Bushings (no rolling elements) are cost as made. If you are looking for a normal needle bearing use "Bearing, Cylindrical Roller" or "Bearing, Needle". Same bearing but I put it under both names to avoid confusion. I haven't seen the jackscrew AIR yet. You can cost them as made if they don't show up in time in the tables.

Add Item Request Update

We have received about 860 items to be added to the tables and have worked through about 560 of them. I've done more today but we aren't going to have them all done by Wednesday, and even if we did you all would need more time to react then two days. I'm putting together a policy document, the summary of which is if your items aren't in the tables X days before the deadline you can include them in your addendum with no surcharge (penalty). So in the mean time you can estimate the final table cost and include that and then "fix" the estimates in the addendum without the 25% penalty.

I hope you see that we are attempting to be fair to teams who submitted their AIR's on time and through no fault of their own the items were not added to the tables.

So I know this is pretty late, but I was looking at Appendix C-3 and had some questions. Is this essentially how the BOM tab on the spreadsheet should look like (minus parts)? Some of the entries don't seem appropriate since they are listed under other assemblies (mainly the tube preps, cuts, and welds under frame). I thought that these values would be included in the processes column of frame, not their own "assembly". Are we stuck with the assembly layout that is listed in C-3?

Hello, Mr. Riley

I have a few Questions

*About FCA Input Spread Sheet

1. Material
Must cross section goes to only three categories (Round/Square/Plate) ?
What is the deadline thickness of plate as millimeter?
My team use metal rectangular bar. Can Icalculate area to my option?

2. Is the difference between "Assembly" and "Part tab" 'Part number"?
ex) A0001 -> Assembly , 00001 -> Part

3. I wrote down items which is on the material table to “Material" on assembly tab.
What do I have to write on "Part"?

* Material - About density
Do I have to find the density unit of raw material? Is choosing of unit free?
ex) my team use : unit: kg/cm^3 , steel: 7.8*E-3, Aluminum: 2.7*E-3, Brass: 8.2*E-10, Teflon: 2.4*E-3, etc
Is it right as above?

Additional question : There is duplicated base number on brake system(BR) of eBOM.
-> 00004 Brake Discs - Disks ,00004 Brake Line - Flexible.

Thanks ~

This message has been edited. Last edited by: MCEH,

MCEH,
(Mr. Riley please correct me if I'm wrong)
1. You can (and should) calculate your own area

2. more or less... you shouldn't have parts to list in a part tab

3. Parts that are costed "As Made" and that you have filled out a part tab for

*You can choose whatever units you want as long as you calculate your total correctly

-> you make your own numbers

If you read the thread from the beginning, I bet you will find the answers to most questions you might come up with about the cost report...

Hope this helped.

Is there a preferred paper size for the hard copy? The extended width of the spreadsheets this year does not allow for them to be printed 1 sided on 8.5x11 paper. Is legal size or 11x17 permitted? Any other requirements for the hard copy?

Open/"Pierre-Oliver": Question on Formatting:


I would assume this is a basic formatting question, and "Pierre-Olivier" it should relate to what you have said in your previous posts. In my cost report I have been trying to follow the basic outline for the Mich eBOM. So I have used what should be correct, but please correct me if wrong. I have been Making Several different Assemblies for each subsystem and putting the parts,materials, Processes, Fasteners, and Tooling in each Assembly, but in this essence I am not sure I will need any EXTRA Part Tabs since I am going so in-depth with my Assembly pages. So I will give an example which will help you determine if I am doing this correctly, It relates to the suspension Section.

For Suspension: I have a total of around 10 Assemblies,[SIMILAR TO THE eBOM FORMAT]. I have been going in-depth with my assemblies w is this OK? hich might be why I don't have any "PART" tabs, is this OK? That I only have Assembly Tabs? I am figuring by going in-depth with the Assemblies will make it easier for formatting.
Here is another question that relates to the "PART" section under an Assembly Page. I could see other teams getting confused by this. My view-point was that for example I have a Push/Pull Rod Assembly and I will list below what I have for each section on my Assembly File. Please Review and see if it is correct Formatting?
1.)PART: "IS THIS FOR PARTS THAT MAKE UP THE ASSEMBLY FROM THE MATERIALS LIST?"
Item Order=1 Part=(Rod End, Industrial) Cost=2.50$per Quantity = 8

2.)MATERIAL: "All materials needed to make up this Assembly?"
= Aluminum "For inserts on ends of Push Rods"
= Carbon Fiber Tube "Which are Cost as Made so I will included Processes below in the procedure to make"

3.)Process:
= Cure Room Temperature
= Machining "for Aluminum Inserts

4.) Fasteners
= Bolt, GRADE AN
= Nut, GRADE AN
= Washer, GRADE AN

5.) Tooling
= Lamination "For Carbon Tubes
= Resin Application "For Tubes"
= Threading Internal "For Rod End"
= Liquid Applicator Gun "For Putting Adhesive on Aluminum Inserts.


----SORRY THIS POST WAS SO LONG, but I wanted to go in-depth so I dont have to repeat any questions. I have done this formatting for nearly every subsystem so I am hoping it is correct, If not I guess I should have asked this question earlier.

THANKS AGAIN!

Michael: Yes, the format is not perfect for the new rules and you should rearrange as you think appropriate.

MCEH:
1) Cross section can be the cross sectional area of an arbitrary shape. So an I-beam, or whatever you want, just type in the area, but you should attach a sketch or some other documentation to explain the cross section.
2) Assemblies begin with "A", parts begin with numbers 0, 1, 2, etc. The assembly tab is basically the same as parts but includes a list of the parts that are in the assembly. Think of it as a parent and the parts are the children.
3) You create parts and assign them part numbers. Materials, Processes, Fasteners and Tooling then belong to a part or an assembly.
Density: the density should match the other units, so if you are using square mm for area and mm for length the density must be in kg/mm^3. If your units are consistent then your math will work out.
Part numbering: the eBOM is just an example to show formatting. Don't read too much into the examples or the duplicate part numbers.

Pierre-Olivier: Absolutely right on everything (I wish I had seen you replied before duplicating your answer).

MSU AET: You can scale to fit, or use more than one page. Believe it or not rule 3.8.1 says must be 8 1/2 x 11 or A4 (not legal).

Ben: It's okay to use a "flatter" BOM structure and have only assemblies under systems - not what I envisioned but not illegal. The only thing I see in your post is that resin application, threading and liquid applicator gun are not tooling but processes. Only items in the tooling Cost Table should be listed in Tooling. That's a general rule, so if an item is in the Process table it should be listed as a Process in the Cost Report.

Just for some clarification, someone earlier remarked about the setup cost per corner for suspension adjustments and mentioned shims. Do we need to cost any shims we use or are they included in the corner setup price?

One more question, it may be irrelevant, but is there a SPECIFIC time cost reports must by postmarked by on Wednesday? I couldn't find anything on the SAE website.


Also Bill thanks for your help! I must have made a mistake when I posted that because I looked at my Push/Pull Rod Assembly and the only item I had under Tooling was Lamination...But I appreciate the quick response....

Also can someone give me an example on Costing Carbon Fiber Tubes as Made? Currently I am using 3 PLYs of Carbon Fiber Sheets and then multiplying by the Surface area? Is there another way on doing this?

Michael: The shim cost is not included. The labor to change shims in the setup is included in the labor process of setting up the corner.

Ben: The latest you can find a post office to post mark on the deadline is the latest you can mail it. Sounds like you've got it right on the tubes.

I'm signing off and the day job will keep me from checking tomorrow so I hope the veterans of VIR will assist the Michigan teams as they are able, and as they have been doing to date.

Thanks,

Bill

One last thing, I think we're caught up on actual cost questions with the exception of authentication number requests and AIR's. The AIR's aren't going to be done by tomorrow but hopefully you all saw my earlier post to estimate the final table cost and then you will be able to correct any differences on those items in the addendum without penalty. The "legal" wording will be available soon, this is paraphrased.

General Question

We are running Motec SDL Dash Display and I was wondering if anyone might know how I should go about costing it. I haven't found it on the cost material table. Anyone have any advice?

One more question

* What does "Item Order" in the items as below means?

Part, Materials, Processes, Fasteners and Tooling table


Thanks~!

Here's another question: We're building our own tachometer-it's going to consist of only electrical components ie resistors, capaicitors, diodes, etc... How should I cost this?

Do any other teams make 13" 1 Piece Magnesium Wheels in House? I am going to have to Cost our wheels as Student Built, but I dont see a 13" 1-Piece Magnesium Wheel "student built section". I am assuming that it may have been forgotten, but please correct me if I am wrong.


MCEH - From what I have taken Item Oder is just a place filler. On my Templates I have just listed item order from 10 - 100 increasing by Ten's. There was a post previously that said to do something similar because for example: you will fill each of these sections up initially with Parts, Processes, Fasteners, Tooling and then later you want to add something between one of the fasteners or processes you will be able to put a "Item Order Number" in between one of the items already there(IE: If it comes between Item order 10 and 20 then you could put a number 15 in between.)I hope this helps.